# Lightroom Classic and CC workflow re metadata



## rob211 (Oct 18, 2017)

Operating System: High Sierra

Lightroom Version: Classic & CC
_(Please go to Help menu > System Info to double check the exact version number)_

I am wondering about the interaction of the CC system and the desktop version, and how a workflow could make the best of both.

I use hierarchical keywords extensively, and do a lot of metadata editing. I was chagrined to see that Lr CC does NOT do hiearchical keywords. Aargh. Apparently you can't do faces or detailed geolocation either. Does that mean I'd have to at least pass all images through Classic to add metadata like that, and possibly other metadata as well? I suppose that's not too different than what I'm doing with Lr Mobile now. But it rather seems that Lr CC won't help much when traveling over what we've got now.

Given the Sensei content searching, is there a way to leverage that to add keywords? or any other metadata? so that it could be used on the desktop?


----------



## johnbeardy (Oct 18, 2017)

Yes, it does mean that. Since I have similar metadata entry needs, although with mainly-flattened keywords, I just don't see much point spending time figuring out how LRCC might fit in with "Classic". Compared with LR Mobile or LR Web, the only  extra metadata in LRCC is location fields. In my view, Adobe are doing a poor job here.

The Sensei AI stuff generates autotags which may be used in its search, but you can't and wouldn't want to make it add keywords. For all the surprising-but-right keywords it could create, there are as many ones that would confuse you. Keyword spam? And those keywords would be stuck in the LRCC-LRW-LRM closed loop, not in "Classic".


----------



## PhilBurton (Oct 18, 2017)

johnbeardy said:


> Yes, it does mean that. Since I have similar metadata entry needs, although with mainly-flattened keywords, I just don't see much point spending time figuring out how LRCC might fit in with "Classic". Compared with LR Mobile or LR Web, the only  extra metadata in LRCC is location fields. In my view, Adobe are doing a poor job here.
> 
> The Sensei AI stuff generates autotags which may be used in its search, but you can't and wouldn't want to make it add keywords. For all the surprising-but-right keywords it could create, there are as many ones that would confuse you. Keyword spam? And those keywords would be stuck in the LRCC-LRW-LRM closed loop, not in "Classic".


I was also disappointed in the announcements, because there isn't a single, unified LR application going forward.

Given the limitations on workflow, on editing features in the cloud version, the separate catalogs (why, oh why Adobe!!)  I still regard the new cloud version as "heavy Elements" (apologies to all the chemists).

I'm also annoyed by the end of perpetual subscriptions.  I'm not entirely surprised, but to protest would be Quixotic.  Since I do value many of the enhancements and new features, sooner or later I will pay The Man the money.

Phil Burton


----------



## Linwood Ferguson (Oct 18, 2017)

It is indeed not a unified environment, certainly not in a seamless fashion.

My personal recommendation is that people not try to make the two work together on their production systems, but instead (if you want to use CC at all) isolate it and learn its details separately.

Note that THERE IS ONLY ONE CLOUD.  So if you are sync'ing your existing catalog to the cloud for lightroom mobile, this IS the cloud, and if you start using CC it will interact with your 2015/LR6 version and/or the upgraded catalog.

I think one should consider clearing out the cloud entirely and stop sync'ing your LR6/2015 catalog if you want to experiment with CC in the cloud.  The export a portion of your production catalog with images to a whole separate location and migrate that into CC and experiment with the idea of (once you learn all you want) erasing it all and starting over later.  Tying experimentation with CC into your production lR6/LR7 catalogs too early will add to what is definitely confusing.


----------



## rob211 (Oct 18, 2017)

So although CC and Classic don't share a catalog on the desktop, they DO share images online?

So if mom.dng is sync'd to the cloud via Classic, it would be a smart preview. As it now is. CC would see it, however (like Lr M does now), and could edit it as well, right? But my second version of Classic on a laptop cannot?

Can I presume that if I sync from CC on the laptop, that the desktop Classic can download and then store and edit mom.dng?

Basically CC is Lr Mobile but now on the desktop as well?


----------



## Linwood Ferguson (Oct 18, 2017)

rob211 said:


> So although CC and Classic don't share a catalog on the desktop, they DO share images online?
> 
> So if mom.dng is sync'd to the cloud via Classic, it would be a smart preview.


Yes.


rob211 said:


> CC would see it, however (like Lr M does now), and could edit it as well, right?


I think so yes. I do not know if there are limitations since it is a smart preview (only) in the cloud.


rob211 said:


> But my second version of Classic on a laptop cannot?


Correct.  In particular, the new features can NOT be used to sync two versions of Classic, or Classic and LR6/2015.  I find that a huge disappointment as it is just so, so close to being able to do that.


rob211 said:


> Can I presume that if I sync from CC on the laptop, that the desktop Classic can download and then store and edit mom.dng?


That is my understanding, bearing in mind that what you are doing is specifying edits; I am not sure that the DNG is changed (or more precisely if you store edits inside the DNG, I do not know if it just sends the edits back, or if it sends a new copy of the DNG back).


rob211 said:


> Basically CC is Lr Mobile but now on the desktop as well?


That's not a wrong interpretation, but my own take on it is different.

LR Mobile seems to have been the foundation upon which they built a whole new tool. The new tool (despite what they say) is not intended to work with Classic, but to be a starting and ending point for workflow.

That it was built on Mobile and Mobile interacted with LR6/2015 ties them together somewhat, and they appear to have made the decision not to remove that feature, but they appear to have put almost no effort into making them inter-operate.  Lack of symmetric sync'ing (originals, metadata, etc.) means that trying to use them together requires a lot of awareness and care to ensure that the limitations do not cause a problem.

I think people who START in CC and stay in CC and never use Classic will find it pretty complete (for a V1 product), indeed the cell phone generation should be absolutely delighted.

I think people who used LR6/2015 and stay in Classic and ignore CC will find it a faster, improved version and be happy.

I think people who try to use them together are going to be frustrated and confused.


----------



## johnbeardy (Oct 18, 2017)

rob211 said:


> Can I presume that if I sync from CC on the laptop, that the desktop Classic can download and then store and edit mom.dng?



Yes, it would do so, just like if you had uploaded an original via LRM.



rob211 said:


> Basically CC is Lr Mobile but now on the desktop as well?



Yes, I think of it as little more than LRM on my laptop. Adobe think of it as more, of course.


----------



## johnbeardy (Oct 18, 2017)

Ferguson said:


> Yes.
> I think people who START in CC and stay in CC and never use Classic will find it pretty complete (for a V1 product), indeed the cell phone generation should be absolutely delighted.
> 
> I think people who used LR6/2015 and stay in Classic and ignore CC will find it a faster, improved version and be happy.
> ...



I agree with this categorisation, though in the first case I think a proportion will soon see its limitations. Someone may be new to imaging software, but have expectations built on what they use at work.

John


----------

