# Camera Support for Perpetual LR License



## Sandyjas (Aug 24, 2018)

I have LR 5 Perpetual License?  I downloaded it from Adobe approx 2013 and I got the CD.  I have a Mac desktop still running Mountain Lion 10.8.4, purchased about the same time.  What is my future if I bought a New Camera from Nikon... in the future?  There will be no support for it in LR5, or I need to upgrade to LR 6, or depending on how far into the future a new camera from Nikon will or will not have support in LR6?  What is LR 7? (I don't read good things about it.)   I read that Perpetual stops at LR6.  I really don't like the idea of Lightroom or my photos being used on a computer that is connected to the Internet.  I like the extra features of my LR 5...much like  LR Classic?  If I am getting any of these names or connections wrong, I have not been following this side of things because I have been so happy indexing all my photos folder by folder with  LR5.  I spent years in the past learning Lightroom and I would not know anything without the help from this board and I can't begin to thank you for this and probably more questions to come.  But I know next to nothing about the evolution of LR from LR5.   Mobiles are not something I want to get into with LR and all the interconnections you can have with Cloud Native LR CC.  I can't use anymore brain to keep up with all the new LR Cloud based stuff and additional support.  I'm worried that if, in the future, I had  to buy a new camera from Nikon (I just broke a lens and had to replace it) that it would not be covered.  And what about 2-4 years from now?   Thank You for putting up with my lack of knowledge.  I want to get of Victoria's book or books, but thought I better check on this first.  Thank You very much for any help!

Thank You,

Sandy


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## Linwood Ferguson (Aug 24, 2018)

All perpetual licenses received support for new cameras through the end of that major version, and the release notes are online somewhere so you should be able to find out which versions support which cameras; but the short version is all that ended with LR 6.14 (if I recall), and no new camera support is or will be added.

Subscription support starts with LR 7 and goes forward, and all subscriptions get new camera support on a pretty quick basis (sometimes before the camera ships, sometimes after).

Your alternatives are:

1) Shoot JPG.
2) Shoot raw, and use the DNG Converter (free, and updated) to convert raw to DNG, which will then be accepted
3) Get the subscription version

If you bought a camera newer than 5.x takes but before 6.14 you could buy a perpetual LR6 license, but that's really not a good option, unless you are just completely opposed to subscription.

Subscription versions of Lightroom Classic (which corresponds to the same "thing" as LR 5) do not require use of the cloud for anything, by the way.  Lightroom CC (as opposed to Lightroom Classic CC) does require use of the cloud; it is a different product that comes "free" with the subscription (alternatively you could say Classic comes free -- you get both, and can use either one or both).


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## Dan Marchant (Aug 27, 2018)

Sandyjas said:


> I have LR 5 Perpetual License.....what if I buy a new camera


As mentioned above, Adobe don't provide continuing updates for old versions of LR when new cameras come out. Instead they provide a free program that converts your new RAW files into DNG files that can be read by your version of Lightroom. 

You won't need it yet but it can be downloaded from Adobe Digital Negative Converter.


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## Sandyjas (Aug 27, 2018)

Thank You for the information and summing it up.  Thank You.  I still can't see why you can't buy a Perpetual Lecense for newer versions of Lightroom.  Maybe in the future?

Thank You both again!

Sandy


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## Sandyjas (Aug 27, 2018)

Thank You for the information and summing it up.  Thank You.  I still can't see why you can't buy a Perpetual Lecense for newer versions of Lightroom.  Maybe in the future?

Thank You both again!

Sandy


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## Linwood Ferguson (Aug 27, 2018)

Sandyjas said:


> Thank You for the information and summing it up.  Thank You.  I still can't see why you can't buy a Perpetual Lecense for newer versions of Lightroom.  Maybe in the future?


Adobe has given no hint that this will happen, and seem very successful at converting everyone to subscription.  I really think there is no hope.


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## PhilBurton (Aug 27, 2018)

Ferguson said:


> Adobe has given no hint that this will happen, and seem very successful at converting everyone to subscription.  I really think there is no hope.


SandyJas,

We had a lot of discussion on this issue before Adobe actually announce LR 7 Classic and its pricing.    Ferguson is right here.  Adobe's business strategy is subscriptions for all their products except the truly consumer Photoshop Elements.  

Speaking only for myself, I found that the improved performance and new/improved functionality in LR 7 were important enough to me that I signed up for a subscription.

Phil Burton


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## Zenon (Aug 28, 2018)

Sandyjas said:


> Thank You for the information and summing it up.  Thank You.  I still can't see why you can't buy a Perpetual Lecense for newer versions of Lightroom.  Maybe in the future?
> 
> Thank You both again!
> 
> Sandy



You can't buy because they don't offer it. They are having far too much success to back so I wouldn't hold my breath.


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## PhilBurton (Aug 28, 2018)

Zenon said:


> You can't buy because they don't offer it. They are having far too much success to back so I wouldn't hold my breath.


Let me amplify what Zenon and Ferguson have said.  _There is absolutely no reason why Adobe would change strategic direction _and offer a perpetual license for LR.  More likely (but still very unlikely) is that they would offer a discount for new customers.  More likely, but still unlikely, is a yearly subscription at a discount from the monthly rate x 12.

And it's not just Adobe.  It's an overall software industry trend to change from perpetual licencing to monthly/yearly subscriptions.


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## Zenon (Aug 28, 2018)

Sandyjas said:


> I have LR 5 Perpetual License?  I downloaded it from Adobe approx 2013 and I got the CD.  I have a Mac desktop still running Mountain Lion 10.8.4, purchased about the same time.  What is my future if I bought a New Camera from Nikon... in the future?  There will be no support for it in LR5, or I need to upgrade to LR 6, or depending on how far into the future a new camera from Nikon will or will not have support in LR6?  What is LR 7? (I don't read good things about it.)   I read that Perpetual stops at LR6.  I really don't like the idea of Lightroom or my photos being used on a computer that is connected to the Internet.  I like the extra features of my LR 5...much like  LR Classic?  If I am getting any of these names or connections wrong, I have not been following this side of things because I have been so happy indexing all my photos folder by folder with  LR5.  I spent years in the past learning Lightroom and I would not know anything without the help from this board and I can't begin to thank you for this and probably more questions to come.  But I know next to nothing about the evolution of LR from LR5.   Mobiles are not something I want to get into with LR and all the interconnections you can have with Cloud Native LR CC.  I can't use anymore brain to keep up with all the new LR Cloud based stuff and additional support.  I'm worried that if, in the future, I had  to buy a new camera from Nikon (I just broke a lens and had to replace it) that it would not be covered.  And what about 2-4 years from now?   Thank You for putting up with my lack of knowledge.  I want to get of Victoria's book or books, but thought I better check on this first.  Thank You very much for any help!
> 
> Thank You,
> 
> Sandy



A few things about your comments.   

_I really don't like the idea of Lightroom or my photos being used on a computer that is connected to the Internet_

You were anyway and may still be. Most stuff on your computer is communicating via the internet as we speak.  When I had perpetual licences that were current Adobe informed me of an update. How could that be possible unless I was connected to the internet?  How does you computer know to tell you there is an OS update?  Ever notice if you look at a lens and then continue surfing that later that lens pops up all over the place?  Only option is to unplug and go off the grid if the net concerns you.                 

_all the interconnections you can have with Cloud Native LR CC_

LR CC was a new product introduced last fall and intended for mobile devices that have no storage. LR Classic CC or LR 7 is no different than LR5 except it has more features. It installs on your computer just like LR5 and you can store are your files locally. You can choose to sync files to the cloud if you want to but you don't have to. I have had LR7 since last October and I don't have a single file in the cloud. I may one day try it when I'm ready. Is it communicating with Adobe? Yes but that is no different than anything else on your computer. It informs you about updates, etc.


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## Rob_Cullen (Aug 30, 2018)

Sandyjas said:


> I still can't see why you can't buy a Perpetual License for newer versions of Lightroom.
> Sandy


I cannot find the links, but from memory-
Corporate Law in the USA prevents a Company from 'realizing' profit or declaring income from any updates to software. eg. for the 14 updates to Version v6.0 perpetual, Adobe gets zilch, nothing. They have to wait, hoping you will pay for an upgrade to v7 (if it were available as perpetual).
With the 'Subscription' regime, they get their money 'in advance' of every update.
What (USA) Company would NOT want the benefits of 'Subscription' software.
I resisted 'Subscription' at first, but now appreciate the regular updates and improvements for less than the cost of a roll of film (from memory!)


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## Zenon (Aug 30, 2018)

I just typed in "purchase LR6" in the Adobe site's search field.  They aren't advertising it and I expect it will not longer be available by 2019.

Download and install Lightroom 6 (Single App license)


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## tspear (Aug 30, 2018)

I-See-Light said:


> I cannot find the links, but from memory-
> Corporate Law in the USA prevents a Company from 'realizing' profit or declaring income from any updates to software. eg. for the 14 updates to Version v6.0 perpetual, Adobe gets zilch, nothing. They have to wait, hoping you will pay for an upgrade to v7 (if it were available as perpetual).
> With the 'Subscription' regime, they get their money 'in advance' of every update.
> What (USA) Company would NOT want the benefits of 'Subscription' software.
> I resisted 'Subscription' at first, but now appreciate the regular updates and improvements for less than the cost of a roll of film (from memory!)



A little more complex, and less a matter of "corporate law" than one of accounting.

On the tax side (which is the largest legal issue),  there is no real difference between the accounting for a new feature if you sell subscription or you sell a perpetual license. It will still count as R&D or expenses depending on how you are setup; and your tax strategy. The R&D/capitalization vs expenses both hit when the feature is released. Where this matters for taxes though is a subscription model tends to even out the revenue streams, versus a sin wave pattern if you do a release every two years.  And this can have huge impacts on your tax strategy.

For the company books, there generally is a much larger hit for perpetual compared to subscription.  There is less revenue recognition requirements, less carry through between the years, R&D/Capitalization items depending on cycle time of releases can be dropped and moved to a straight expense model. It offers much more predictable income, reduces cash management issues and modeling.... If the company is publicly traded, then the CEO/CFO are legally required to comply with the accounting rules, but that is really the only legal jeopardy.

Tim


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## Linwood Ferguson (Aug 30, 2018)

Accounting matters, but I would wager a nearly equal issue is that subscriptions yield predictability, not just the steady cash flow, but Adobe knows more about its subscriber base.  With 2 years between a release, marketing always wonders how many will adopt the new version (and pay).  A major release is always a trigger for people to evaluate "stay with Adobe, switch to something else, or just sit tight". 

With subscription, there's no trigger, no mass re-think event.   People just tend to stay and stay.  A new version comes out they may think "do I install now or later", but rarely do they tie the version to "should I keep subscribing". Inertial carries the day.   Marketing can probably predict to a few percent what their base will be next quarter (at least their renewal rate if not new subscriptions), and wall street likes predictability almost better than revenue.

It's why so very many things push auto-renewal -- they do not want you to DECIDE to stay.  They want you to have to decide to go; do nothing you stay. People are really, really good at doing nothing.


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## tspear (Aug 30, 2018)

@Ferguson 

I agree. I was just commenting on the "corporate legal" statement. 

Tim


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## clee01l (Aug 30, 2018)

Ferguson said:


> Accounting matters, but I would wager a nearly equal issue is that subscriptions yield predictability, not just the steady cash flow


. It is easier to borrow capital with a steady subscription revenue stream than it would be to borrow against projected future sales.


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## Rob_Cullen (Aug 30, 2018)

Thanks tspear and Linwood for the explanations, accounting never was my 'forte' here in Oz down under!
I knew there would be some more expertise answers than mine.


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## PhilBurton (Aug 31, 2018)

I-See-Light said:


> I cannot find the links, but from memory-
> Corporate Law in the USA prevents a Company from 'realizing' profit or declaring income from any updates to software. eg. for the 14 updates to Version v6.0 perpetual, Adobe gets zilch, nothing. They have to wait, hoping you will pay for an upgrade to v7 (if it were available as perpetual).
> With the 'Subscription' regime, they get their money 'in advance' of every update.
> What (USA) Company would NOT want the benefits of 'Subscription' software.
> I resisted 'Subscription' at first, but now appreciate the regular updates and improvements for less than the cost of a roll of film (from memory!)


It's actually a bit more complex, and I learned about this issue the hard way.  I promised all customers who bought release 2 now, that they would get release 3 for free when it (finally, finally) came out.  I did that so sales for my products would not dry up.  All good, right?  Wrong.  Release 3 was not available until the NEXT FISCAL YEAR, and this kicked in "revenue recognition."  Put simply, if customers bought the product now, _part of what we promised and they paid fo_r is release 3.  And since we didn't deliver release 3 in the same fiscal year as the purchase, we couldn't "recognize" the full revenue from the sale in the current fiscal year.

The practical impact was that a lot of sales guys in my company didn't get paid their "meet your quota" bonus, which was a lot of money, and were they angry.  At me.   Also, they didn't go to "club," and if you are in sales, "club" is some kind of nice trip or other award for meeting your quota, "making your number."  It's a prestige thing among sales people.  All of these consequences were my fault.    
That's how I learned about revenue recognition.  But I never heard that a commitment to continued support would trigger this situation.


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## PhilBurton (Aug 31, 2018)

clee01l said:


> . It is easier to borrow capital with a steady subscription revenue stream than it would be to borrow against projected future sales.


True, because future revenues are more predictable.  Also subscription revenues result in a higher stock price than perpetual license revenues for the same amount.  Wall Street loves subscription revenue.


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## Zenon (Sep 1, 2018)

Speaking of being connected to the internet. We are on the road. Using  Yahoo I get this same sponsored message when I'm at home. It just changed from my home city to my current location.


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