# Demise of LR user, how can the family access the images



## x Aperture (Dec 15, 2019)

How does the family of a dead Lightroom user access the editted images after the subscription has expired.

This question came up at the local Apple group - what are rules guidelines etc.

Thanks for any help


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## johnbeardy (Dec 15, 2019)

Classic Lightroom or Cloudy Lightroom?

Can the family access the user's computer. If so, they can open Classic Lightroom  and do anything to the images except go into Develop. 

If Cloudy, they need to get the user's Adobe account and password, after which they can use the Lightroom Downloader to download everything in the cloud.


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## clee01l (Dec 15, 2019)

x Aperture said:


> How does the family of a dead Lightroom user access the editted images after the subscription has expired.
> 
> This question came up at the local Apple group - what are rules guidelines etc.
> 
> Thanks for any help



There are 2 Lightroom’s to consider. 

Lightroom Classic is the desktop version and continues to work in a limited fashion after the subscription has expired. With it you can export derivatives of all the important files as well as access the unedited originals. It will continue to work as long as OS upgrades don’t make it unusable. 


Lightroom (cloudy) stores everything in the Adobe Cloud. When the subscription expires, you have a time period (30 days?, 6 months?) to download originals and create edited derivatives. 


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## x Aperture (Dec 15, 2019)

Thank you Cleetus and John- I will pass this on.
I am glad I have not ventured onto the cloud


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## x Aperture (Dec 15, 2019)

Thinking about this, the cloudy version is a much more higher risk version if a monthly or yearly payment is missed due to errors, missed payments, missing internet etc. And would require inheritors be it business or family  to have the knowledge and awareness that they had to act promptly to avoid loosing valuable information.


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## Hal P Anderson (Dec 15, 2019)

clee01l said:


> It will continue to work as long as OS upgrades don’t make it unusable.


Actually, even after the subscription is allowed to lapse, you can continue to use Creative Cloud to upgrade Lightroom Classic to the current release.


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## clee01l (Dec 15, 2019)

x Aperture said:


> Thinking about this, the cloudy version is a much more higher risk version if a monthly or yearly payment is missed due to errors, missed payments, missing internet etc. And would require inheritors be it business or family  to have the knowledge and awareness that they had to act promptly to avoid loosing valuable information.


I have a folder in my file cabinet labeled "In Case of..."  It contains a copy of my will, medical and legal directives  and computer logins and passwords for my financial online accounts and email.   Also there are instructions about all of my important web sites including my Lightroom Account.  I haven't included it yet, but I intend to export any of my important photos hosted in Lightroom.  
I pay my Adobe Subscription annually, so hopefully there will be grace period after I "shuffle off this mortal coil" before the statue of limitations runs out with Adobe Cloud.


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## johnbeardy (Dec 15, 2019)

x Aperture said:


> Thinking about this, the cloudy version is a much more higher risk version if a monthly or yearly payment is missed due to errors, missed payments, missing internet etc. And would require inheritors be it business or family  to have the knowledge and awareness that they had to act promptly to avoid loosing valuable information.



Yes. Adobe store cloud-based files for a year, but after a death it can take time to sort stuff out and user names and passwords can easily be overlooked.

WIth Classic, all the originals are stored locally, so even without Lightroom you could get to the files. Lightroom would help you make sense of the pixel mountain, find the best stuff and see the user's adjustments.


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## Califdan (Dec 15, 2019)

It should be pointed out that there is a lot of legal brew-ha-ha going on related to "digital rights after death" issues.  It seems that "legally" when someone dies, access to all of their digital assets (e.g all their online accounts such as Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, Snapchat and, yes, Adobe Cloud among others) is illegal - even if their heirs know the password.    Some of these providers apparently are monitoring death registers and locking accounts when someone shows up as having passed.    The process to get such accounts un-locked is not standard and each provider seems to be on a different page in terms of what one needs to do, and what documentation needs to be provided,  to get such accounts unlocked.  

Due to all of this, it's best not to die.    

It also seems that lawyer types who write wills and trusts are starting to add sections to such documents pertaining specifically to online digital assets.  In general, they are adding language that bequeaths rights to various digital assets to named heirs.   This presumably will allow heirs to go to online providers and have the account of the deceased unlocked or transferred to the heir.

Just one more thing to think and worry about.


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## Linwood Ferguson (Dec 15, 2019)

Califdan said:


> Due to all of this, it's best not to die.



Noted.



Califdan said:


> It also seems that lawyer types who write wills and trusts are starting to add sections to such documents pertaining specifically to online digital assets.  In general, they are adding language that bequeaths rights to various digital assets to named heirs.   This presumably will allow heirs to go to online providers and have the account of the deceased unlocked or transferred to the heir.


The problem with all this is that most such organizations tend to be unreachable, unless you get lucky to catch a human's attention.  Adobe might be different, but even there you will get a call center who might not know how to handle "I'm the executor of a will and need you to release an account" calls.  But imagine trying to call Facebook or Google.  Lots of horror stories about accounts suspended and having no appeal mechanism, just automated emails, no human access.

Local storage!


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## RikkFlohr (Dec 16, 2019)

xAperture  Would you mind making a feature request at this link: Lightroom Classic | Photoshop Family Customer Community

We would love to work on some way to create a means of transfer to descendants.


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## johnbeardy (Dec 16, 2019)

Two years ago I tried to get some traction on this, Rikk, possibly when you were between Adobe contracts (search you know where for "Next of kin and other sunset terms").


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## Jimmsp (Dec 17, 2019)

x Aperture said:


> How does the family of a dead Lightroom user access the edited images after the subscription has expired.


I was just having this conversation again last night with a good friend who is also a photographer.
I live in a retirement community in AZ. As a older retiree who has talked with others like me and my kids about this and related issues,  the key word you use is edited. My family members, and a lot of others like me, don't want to have to learn programs like Lightroom in order to have access to my photos. We could argue that they don't even want all the photos that I consider "good" (think birds in flight) but they do want access to the family photos. Now, this is not to say that some surviving family member wants to continue on with LR and the digital experience, but that is a rare person, imo.

So what I and others like me have done or will do is to take the "good" images that I have and store them off line on a hard drive; not a backup, but a family archive. In my case, they only need to be edited jpegs. Space is not an issue, but organization is.  In addition, I am going to start to make more prints - probably just simple books, as loose prints are harder for folks to deal with.


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## Linwood Ferguson (Dec 17, 2019)

Jimmsp said:


> So what I and others like me have done or will do is to take the "good" images that I have and store them off line on a hard drive; not a backup, but a family archive. In my case, they only need to be edited jpegs. Space is not an issue, but organization is.  In addition, I am going to start to make more prints - probably just simple books, as loose prints are harder for folks to deal with.


I would go one further -- pay for a web site and post them there, either privately or publicly as you prefer, ahead of time. Have ties (structure, file name, something) so they can get back to your archive -- which may be larger of course). 

Relatives are often remote, and may be numerous - this lets them look before you pass, know it's there, and use it as something of an index to know what they may want to dig deeper for.

You can then build collects in Lightroom that update both your family archive, and family web site, automagically with published collections.

Fundamentally most kids, and a lot of adults now, if they cannot find something from their phone, it doesn't exist.


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## RikkFlohr (Dec 17, 2019)

johnbeardy said:


> Two years ago I tried to get some traction on this, Rikk, possibly when you were between Adobe contracts (search you know where for "Next of kin and other sunset terms").


I poked around John and didn't find anything.


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## LRList001 (Dec 18, 2019)

Jimmsp said:


> I was just having this conversation again last night with a good friend who is also a photographer.
> I live in a retirement community in AZ. As a older retiree who has talked with others like me and my kids about this and related issues,  the key word you use is edited. My family members, and a lot of others like me, don't want to have to learn programs like Lightroom in order to have access to my photos. We could argue that they don't even want all the photos that I consider "good" (think birds in flight) but they do want access to the family photos. Now, this is not to say that some surviving family member wants to continue on with LR and the digital experience, but that is a rare person, imo.
> 
> So what I and others like me have done or will do is to take the "good" images that I have and store them off line on a hard drive; not a backup, but a family archive. In my case, they only need to be edited jpegs. Space is not an issue, but organization is.  In addition, I am going to start to make more prints - probably just simple books, as loose prints are harder for folks to deal with.



I have a halfway house solution.  All my raw and processed jpegs are stored on unencrypted drives outside my windows logon (internal HDDs).  Thus any moderately competent windows person can simply take the drives out and plug them into something else and they will find the lot.  If they are mildly keen, they will also find all the installers, the licence codes and the catalogues, I make sure that installers etc are copied across the various local drives as well as the NAS and the automatic backup and DR solutions I have in place.  Nothing I have in the cloud is needed.  With more effort it is possible to create a virtualised environment running old OSes too, though that is beyond basic Windows and MacOS competence and is not necessary.


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## x Aperture (Dec 18, 2019)

RikkFlohr said:


> xAperture  Would you mind making a feature request at this link: Lightroom Classic | Photoshop Family Customer Community
> 
> We would love to work on some way to create a means of transfer to descendants.


Rikk  - Once I have got passed the login requirements for the site I will try and raise an issue - once it is done I will highlight here so you can all jump in and say - me too


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## clee01l (Dec 18, 2019)

x Aperture said:


> Rikk - Once I have got passed the login requirements for the site I will try and raise an issue - once it is done I will highlight here so you can all jump in and say - me too



The log-in requirements are to simply use your same Adobe ID and Password used to access the Adobe apps in your subscription.


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## Zenon (Dec 19, 2019)

johnbeardy said:


> Yes. Adobe store cloud-based files for a year, but after a death it can take time to sort stuff out and user names and passwords can easily be overlooked.
> 
> WIth Classic, all the originals are stored locally, so even without Lightroom you could get to the files. Lightroom would help you make sense of the pixel mountain, find the best stuff and see the user's adjustments.



The work around for cloudy would be store RAW files locally as well for family access later so they don't have to worry about it. I still think this would all be daunting for family members who don't use any developer or know what RAW is. At least the files are there and they could hire a service to process images they want to keep. Otherwise view the RAW files on TV, etc


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## clee01l (Dec 19, 2019)

Two years ago, my wife passed away. She. Did not use Lightroom and did not shoot RAW. There was a memorial service 2 or so weeks later and it was my responsibility to put together a slideshow to showcase her life and work.
All of her photo collections were stored in her laptop and on her phone. 
Two weeks is not a long time to be fumbling around trying to get to important photos in the midst of the stress associated with the passing of a loved one. I have the computer skills, if it had been the other way around, my late wife did not. 

In think about this topic, I have developed some ideas. 
Each of us should have a portfolio of work that WE think important .
Perhaps it should be in derivative form in the Adobe cloud or similar so that our loved ones can quickly access that.
Also the source material should be marked and preserved LOCALLY. Let my heirs decide whether the original images are to be kept. I’m not a professional, I’ve entered very few competitions and never won anything so you might say my portfolio is worthless except to me and maybe my heirs. 

If you haven’t put together an “In the event of...” portfolio, you should if you want your heirs to appreciate your work after you are gone. Maybe we think to highly of our own creations. I agree that Adobe needs to develop some mechanism to make a subscribers work available to heirs But I don’t think it needs to go much beyond that


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## johnbeardy (Dec 19, 2019)

Books, Cletus!


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## clee01l (Dec 19, 2019)

johnbeardy said:


> Books, Cletus!



??


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## johnbeardy (Dec 20, 2019)

Create books, or make prints. If nothing else survives, they stand a decent chance.


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## Jimmsp (Dec 20, 2019)

johnbeardy said:


> Create books, or make prints. If nothing else survives, they stand a decent chance.



I fully agree.  We have done the test a couple of times  in recent years when we moved houses.   
A box of prints is fine to sort through as a family, and generates conversation when viewed together. But in the end no one really wants them or takes them home. I think they are worth printing for the family and family discussions, but expect most of them to be thrown away.
 But they do take the books. And the books will survive the test of time.


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## x Aperture (Dec 24, 2019)

I have joined the forum mentioned above and found a thread call "Looking for a Lightroom Exit Strategy"
Looking for a Lightroom exit strategy | Photoshop Family Customer Community

It appears to cover all the issues and I added a request for a simple proforma for users to pass on to  their beneficiaries.


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## x Aperture (Dec 15, 2019)

How does the family of a dead Lightroom user access the editted images after the subscription has expired.

This question came up at the local Apple group - what are rules guidelines etc.

Thanks for any help


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## Victoria Bampton (Dec 24, 2019)

x Aperture said:


> It appears to cover all the issues and I added a request for a simple proforma for users to pass on to  their beneficiaries.





> or for the Likes of The Lightroom Queen to produce a sample single page document that Lightroom Users can customise with their local information (eg drive, folder organisation etc) for the successor to use.



It's an interesting idea. I'd welcome any suggestions about what information you (or anyone) thinks should be included on such a document.


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## Replytoken (Dec 24, 2019)

This is an interesting topic, and one that has crossed my mind in various forms over the past few years.  As much as I am concerned about my images, and I have not really decided what I would instruct my beloved to do with them after I leave this planet, this seems to be part of a larger issue of access to digital assets and accounts.  And while Victoria has been gracious enough to consider the above suggestion, I am wondering if using something like what LastPass offers in its Family Plan is a better solution for many of these issues (beyond just photographs).  LP allows a large amount of information to be stored in their "password" database, including detailed notes.  And, with the Family Plan, a user can designate anybody they wish to have emergency access to their database.  I think that this might be a better solution as everything is then in one place for access to accounts, and the person who has been designated knows they have access.  One could leave their Adobe credentials in the database along with very specific instructions for access and plans for any images (in CC, on local drives, or anywhere the images reside.  The only thing that this might not address is if an account was locked on death as was mentioned by @Califdan  above.  Something akin to electronic version of Cletus' written note described above as well.  Something to consider.

--Ken


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