# should I buy macbook pro with retina display for editing in Lightroom?



## dtbain

Hi all

I am considering buying a 15 inch macbook pro with retina display to edit my pics in Lightroom but have some questions.

I know that laptops are not ideal for photo editing but while I am a serious-ish photographer, I am not a professional and, after a long day's work at a desk, I like to edit my photos sitting on a sofa at night! 

I would prefer 17 inches to 15.4 but apple don't do 17 inches any more, yet I am inclining towards apple for four reasons:  (a) I hear they're fast, (b) I hear the screens are great for picture editing, (c) I've had various frustrations with windows over the years, and (d) windows 8 in particular looks counter-intuitive.

But if I do go apple that will be a big change for me since I've so far been using a Dell Inspiron 1720 (1920 x 1080 resolution), which I've liked, though it's 7 years old and now sluggish.

I'd REALLY appreciate for any advice regarding any or all of the following questions -- thanks VERY much for your time in advance!

1.  Is the macbook pro really a good deal* better than the competition*, regarding in particular its screen and speed?  (It better be for the money!)  One photographer told me she didn't like the retina display because it meant things looked very different on the screen compared with when printed.  Is that right and a worry? 

2.  I take it that, as someone with a LR for pc license, I *don't need to pay more to install LR for mac *on it?

3.  I take it that it would be s*traightforward transferring my pics and catalog *from a pc to a mac?

4.  While I am inclined to get the 1TB storage I could get less if I used an *external hdd *(whcih would also have the upside that my wife could edit our catalog on her computer without needing to borrow mine), but I take it that would slow the macbook down:  both because an xhdd won't be as quick as a SSD, and because the link between xhdd and macbook would slow things down?  If so, it seems silly to pay for the speed and then lose it by attaching an xhdd.  Does that seem right?  (I take it one day we'll all edit our pics in the cloud, e.g. using dropbox, but currently that would be very sluggish I am assuming.)

5.  I could always attach an *external monitor*, I take it, if I decided that sometimes I needed something bigger than 15.4".  Yes?

6.  Importantly, it is cheaper for me to buy the macbook in the US.  Are there signficant *downsides to buying a laptop for UK in US (*e.g. different keyboard layout, inapplicable warranty, different power cord, etc)?

7.  Finally, if I don't go for the apple, what *alternative would you recommend?*  I hear dell xps are good (though also max 15").  Also heard good things about HP envy.  The equivalent to my Dell, which I've liked, is I think the Dell 17R SE.  Any views?[/INDENT]

Thank you in advance SO much.  I appreciate this is a lot of questions, but any advice you have under any of them would be REALLY appreciated.

Thanks again

David


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## clee01l

David, Welcome to our forum. 
 I made this switch almost two years ago now.  My primary computer though is a 27" iMac.  No, it does not have a retina display. but it does have an IPS monitor with 2560X1440 aspect ratio.  A question that I ask is do you really need portability?  And do you need portability all the time?   If you find yourself at a desk with your laptop perched in the same place then the answer is probably no.  When you are mobile, how likely are you to need to use LR to process your images?   Answers to those questions can determine whether you really need a 15" rMBP.  Perhaps the answer is somewhere in between.  Maybe you can only afford one machine and need some portability.  If that is the case, a rMBP and a large IPS monitor would suffice.  Perhaps your portability needs do not include LR, then a desktop with the horsepower for LR and keep your old laptop to check email and browse the web in Starbucks.  Or maybe get the iMac and an iPad,  The LR license permits you to install on two computers that you own and use.  It is a multi platform license which means that you can install the same license on Windows and OSX

What I ended up doing was getting a 13" rMBP in addition to my iMac and my iPad.  Sometimes I travel to take photos and need a laptop to process images in the hotel at night.  For this limited LR workflow, the 13" rMBP was ideal. 

Don't buy the retina screen just for LR.  All that means is more pixels in a smaller space.  More pixels in a larger format is IMO more beneficial to LR Standard aspect ratios for PC monitors is ~1920X1080 although because of Apple, you can buy monitors with more pixels like the 2560X1440 ASUS IPS monitor that I have to use in dual along side my 27" iMac.

If you don't need a PC for Windows specific applications and the price difference in intel equipment does not bother you, then the Apple is a better deal because it has less hassle , no need for Virus tools to slow down processing CPUs.  Life is more peaceful running OSX and there is less to go wrong.  I spend less time maintaining my operating system since I went to OSX  

It can be straight forward transferring LR from a PC environment to OSX, but most people are not aware how to go about it properly.  If you get to that point, I can advise on how best to prepare for and make the move painlessly.  Don't wait until after you get your OSX before asking how to approach the migration. 

The biggest difference between a LR catalog on Windows and one on OSX is the absolute path maintained in the catalog to your master images. Windows uses drive letters in the path to each volume. OSX uses the UNIX scheme for mounting volumes. The drive letter concept is foreign and limited to only the DOS/Windows operating systems.


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## dtbain

Thanks Cletus, that's very helpful.  I think I do "need" the portability just given my default editing location is my sofa while half-watching TV (shameful, I know!).

Two quick follow-ups:

a.  Can you explain to me what an IPS monitor is (apologies for my ignorance)?

b.  I haven't ruled out having an external monitor down the line, if I find there are things for which the 15 inches is no good.  I see that I could get an apple Thunderbolt display.  Are there also non-apple options for external displays (of good quality) to hook up to rMBP?

Very many thanks again for spending so much time on my questions.

d


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## dtbain

PS.  I like the idea of having an iPad one day to show my pics, but I take it that I can't edit in LR on an iPad, or at least not easily?

d


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## clee01l

IPS = In Plane Switching It is the technology behind HiDPI monitors like Apple's Retina and iPads, iMacs etc.   Here is a link to more information. http://www.slrlounge.com/what-is-an-ips-monitor-understanding-ips-displays
Typical conventional screen resolution is between 96-120 dpi.  A retina display is something ~220 dpi.  You do not need a HiDPI monitor to get IPS.  

The problem that needs to be addressed by the applications that run on HiDPI and conventional monitors is dealing with the differences.  For instance, a typical button icon is going to be ~32X32pixels on a conventional monitor or about 1/3"X1/3"  Place that same button on a Retina display and it is about 1/4 the size or 0.15"X0.15".  

A 27" Apple Cinema Display Costs ~ $1000USD.  A 27" ASUS IPS display with the same screen size is ~$500USD. I don't find an advantage in getting a Thunderbolt connector on an Apple Cinema Display.


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## Selwin

I am biased towards large screens. My main LR machine is a Mac Pro with 30" Apple Cinema Display. I used to have a 17 inch Macbook Pro (2006 model) but it died this year of age I guess.

For LR editing, screen size and screen quality are most important to me. With the 17" options gone by Apple, there's not much to like AFAIC. I certainly don't see the need for Retina. If my 13" Macbook would break too, I think I'd go for a 17" refurb. Screen area is very important when using LR, because the panels areas decrease the actual image size when editing. I always need both left and right panels when editing.

If you go for a 15" macbook pro, I would choose the non-retina with faster processor and/or more RAM. Unless you're like my friend John who lately got himself a 15" rMBP w/ 1TB SSD, 16GB RAM and the top processor. Cost him 3.5k.

About external monitors: I regret having chosen Apple 5 years ago. Other current panels in 27" size are large enough, cheaper and more true in their color range. I would stay away from the 27" Apple screen, although it's less expensive than the Eizo IPS 27" panels.


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## Victoria Bampton

1. I have the 15" retina and it's beautiful!  My EIZO looks really fuzzy next to it.  Just be aware the prints may be a bit softer than they appear on screen.


2. Correct


3. Yep, instructions are here: How do I move Lightroom to a new computer?


4. I have 512GB in my 15" and 256GB in my 13".  256 is a bit tight for space.  512GB is comfortable - I store my photos on NAS and use LR5's Smart Previews for speed on the MBP, although I also have a small SSD in a USB 3.0 case which I can use if I need the originals on a fast external.



5. Yep, you can attach up to 3 external monitors (2 mini display port and 1 HDMI)


6. I've always purchased within the UK, especially if you pick up a refurb or a sale item from a third party seller.


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## Selwin

Victoria Bampton said:


> 1. I have the 15" retina and it's beautiful!  My EIZO looks really fuzzy next to it.  Just be aware the prints may be a bit softer than they appear on screen.


Hi Victoria 
I don't doubt at all that the 15" rMBP has a very nice screen. Question is: is it large enough for serious LR work?


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## Victoria Bampton

IMHO yes. Because the screen is so high res, you can always change the resolution from the optimum retina setting, to make the text and panels smaller if you need to. I haven't felt the need to do so.


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## Selwin

Cool. May check one out as soon as my 13" MBP starts to decay, which I hope isn't anytime soon. It's a 2008 2.0GHz so it's quite slow, but manageable on trips for selecting and key wording. I changed the HD to a 128GB SSD and I took out the optical bay and inserted a 500GB 5400rpm drive for backups, iTunes library and some other stuff. It's a great feeling of having two drives while traveling on extended trips. All I never got used to was not having a backlighted keyboard. It's not a Pro.

I must say the Apple laptops have very good screens. When I enter a commuter train full of movie watching travelers, I can really notice the screen quality difference between MacBooks and most windows laptops. Not all, but most.

Thanks for your reply.


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## clee01l

Victoria Bampton said:


> IMHO yes. Because the screen is so high res, you can always change the resolution from the optimum retina setting, to make the text and panels smaller if you need to. I haven't felt the need to do so.


You are young enough that presbyopia is not *yet* an issue for you.  HiDPI screens are nice, but that acuity comes at a price. {Cmd}{+} doesn't work on that tiny gray on gray print in the panels.  I like my Retina Display for some things but I curse it for others!


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## Selwin

clee01l said:


> You are young enough that presbyopia is not *yet* an issue for you. […]


Yes my opinion is that actual screen area (17" vs 15") is more important than tiny pixels (Retina vs normal). That is why I would go 17" refurb and not 15" Retina. To each their own I guess. Maybe Apple will eventually release a new 17" rMBP in their line-up, but it's probably out of my price range anyway.


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## dtbain

Thanks again Cletus, and for the link, which was exceptionally helpful.  Can I ask a few follow-ups if you have the time ...

a.  I remain a bit confused about resolutions.  My current dell inspiron 1720 has a resolution of 1920 x 1200.  The rMBP has 2880 x 1800.  What do these numbers represent?  And how do they relate to dpi figures?  Is dpi measuring the same thing but in a different way, or something else?  (I am guessing that "2880 x 1800" means there are 2880 pixels horizontally x 1800 vertically on the screen as a whole, and and the dip measurement is the number of pixels per inch.  Is that right?!)

b.  When you say there's no "advantage in getting a thuderbolt connector on an apple cinema display", I don't follow.  Do you mean that the ASUS display is just as good as the Apple Cinema Display?

c.  Given what you say about the problem that HiDPI makes images smaller, is there a worry that I would have to use the rMBP at about the same resolution as my existing latpop (1920 x 1200) hence that there's no point paying the extra for the retina display?

d.  Finally, the article you cited, while really useful, didn't make clear whether the rMPB display is TN or IPS.  I assume it's IPS.  But oddly the authors says "Panasonic (who purchased IPS technology from Hitachi), Hitachi, Samsung, Toshiba, Sony and Sharp are the best manufacturers of IPS technology".  So is Apple not as good or does it buy its screens from one of those manufacturers or did he forget Apple?!

Thanks lots

David


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## dtbain

Thanks Victora, as ALWAYS, that's really really helpful.  Follow-ups, if you've time:

a.  What's a NAS?!

b.  I don't know about smart previews.  I've been told they enable you somehow to edit a smaller version of the picture while on the move (or in my case the sofa) while keeping the full picture on an external drive.  That sounds like it should be impossible!  Might you have a link that would explain it to me?

c.  I find it a bit irritating editing pics that live on an external hard drive -- though if I could make this less irritating it would mean that my wife and I could edit the same catalog on our own computers, not her borrow mine.  What I've got is http://www.amazon.co.uk/Samsung-500GB-Slimline-Portable-Drive/dp/B008PSEWRG#productDetails.  Is the USB3 SSD you mentioned smaller and better than this?

d.  Is there a particular external display you'd recommend?

e.  Finally, you talked about refurbs etc.  I take it you would advise getting the 15" rMBP over a refurbed 17" MBP?  In any case, any suggestions as to places where discounts or sales (new year sales?!) on Apples ever occur?

Thanks lots

d




Victoria Bampton said:


> 1. I have the 15" retina and it's beautiful!  My EIZO looks really fuzzy next to it.  Just be aware the prints may be a bit softer than they appear on screen.
> 
> 
> 2. Correct
> 
> 
> 3. Yep, instructions are here: How do I move Lightroom to a new computer?
> 
> 
> 4. I have 512GB in my 15" and 256GB in my 13".  256 is a bit tight for space.  512GB is comfortable - I store my photos on NAS and use LR5's Smart Previews for speed on the MBP, although I also have a small SSD in a USB 3.0 case which I can use if I need the originals on a fast external.
> 
> 
> 
> 5. Yep, you can attach up to 3 external monitors (2 mini display port and 1 HDMI)
> 
> 
> 6. I've always purchased within the UK, especially if you pick up a refurb or a sale item from a third party seller.


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## dtbain

Interesting.  What resolution do you have your rMPB set to when using LR?  Sound like not at its max res.  If one did, wouldn't the panels be too fiddly?

Thanks

d



Victoria Bampton said:


> IMHO yes. Because the screen is so high res, you can always change the resolution from the optimum retina setting, to make the text and panels smaller if you need to. I haven't felt the need to do so.


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## dtbain

Thanks to all of you.  This is a great resource.  One more general question:  whether I go Apple or not, what specs do I need for LR to function well (i.e. quickly!), in particular ...

1.  How much RAM?

2.  How fast and what type of processor?

3.  Do I need a dedicated graphics card?

Thanks

d


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## dtbain

Argh, have just been reminded of another question ...

Do I need to calibrate my display?  Any links on how to do so?  Most important:  someone told me that rMPB displays can't be calibrated.  Is this true?  If so does it matter?

thanks

d


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## Selwin

Hi David,

A current laptop with 8GB of RAM will run Lightroom quite smoothly. No dedicated video necessary IMHO. Spend the money on a decent screen. If you can stretch it to an internal SSD that will speed LR up for searching the database (which happens all the time, even if you don't realise it). 

Monitor calibration is essential for all Photography work, whether LR or Photoshop CS or CC. You'll be fine with the basic products like spyder or i1.


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## clee01l

dtbain said:


> Thanks again Cletus, and for the link, which was exceptionally helpful.  Can I ask a few follow-ups if you have the time ...
> 
> a.  I remain a bit confused about resolutions.  My current dell inspiron 1720 has a resolution of 1920 x 1200.  The rMBP has 2880 x 1800.  What do these numbers represent?  And how do they relate to dpi figures?  Is dpi measuring the same thing but in a different way, or something else?  (I am guessing that "2880 x 1800" means there are 2880 pixels horizontally x 1800 vertically on the screen as a whole, and and the dip measurement is the number of pixels per inch.  Is that right?!)


You are correct that 2880 & 1920 refer to the horizontal pixels.  If you measure the 1920 Dell pixels you will see that you 17" (diagonal) monitor is about 16" from left to right/  The 15" rMBP is 220 pixels per inch, So, it will measure ~13" horizontally


> b.  When you say there's no "advantage in getting a thuderbolt connector on an apple cinema display", I don't follow.  Do you mean that the ASUS display is just as good as the Apple Cinema Display?


Apple does not make any monitors. In fact all or almost all of the monitors sold by Apple, Dell HP etc are manufactured by LG Displays or Samsung.  LG Displays make the IPS monitors for Apple and ASUS.  Apple will tell you that the quality control and hardware behind the screen meets higher specifications.  But, I have an ASUS and an iMac side by side and calibrated with the same tool.  The ASUS whites are whiter and the iMac whites have a slight yellow tinge.  





> c.  Given what you say about the problem that HiDPI makes images smaller, is there a worry that I would have to use the rMBP at about the same resolution as my existing latpop (1920 x 1200) hence that there's no point paying the extra for the retina display?


You will use the HiDPI display at its native resolution.  Apple has the technology and most Application developers have coded their apps to take advantage of that technology to adapt to the greater pixel density so that text and buttons use more pixels on a retina display and appear about the same size on a Retina Display as that do on a conventional display





> d.  Finally, the article you cited, while really useful, didn't make clear whether the rMPB display is TN or IPS.  I assume it's IPS.  But oddly the authors says "Panasonic (who purchased IPS technology from Hitachi), Hitachi, Samsung, Toshiba, Sony and Sharp are the best manufacturers of IPS technology".  So is Apple not as good or does it buy its screens from one of those manufacturers or did he forget Apple?!


Yes, the rMBP is  IPS


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## Victoria Bampton

dtbain said:


> a.  What's a NAS?!



Network storage - plugs into an ethernet port and can be accessed over the network by any computer instead of having to plug in an external drive.



dtbain said:


> b.  I don't know about smart previews.  I've been told they enable you somehow to edit a smaller version of the picture while on the move (or in my case the sofa) while keeping the full picture on an external drive.  That sounds like it should be impossible!  Might you have a link that would explain it to me?



It's very clever!!!  Try this: http://helpx.adobe.com/lightroom/help/lightroom-smart-previews.html



dtbain said:


> c.  I find it a bit irritating editing pics that live on an external hard drive -- though if I could make this less irritating it would mean that my wife and I could edit the same catalog on our own computers, not her borrow mine.  What I've got is http://www.amazon.co.uk/Samsung-500GB-Slimline-Portable-Drive/dp/B008PSEWRG#productDetails.  Is the USB3 SSD you mentioned smaller and better than this?



Same kind of deal (that's a slower standard drive), except I bought the USB 3.0 enclosure and the SSD separately and plugged them together myself.



dtbain said:


> d.  Is there a particular external display you'd recommend?



Depends on your budget.



dtbain said:


> e.  Finally, you talked about refurbs etc.  I take it you would advise getting the 15" rMBP over a refurbed 17" MBP?  In any case, any suggestions as to places where discounts or sales (new year sales?!) on Apples ever occur?


I haven't looked at the specs of the 17", but the 15" have newer processors so should be faster.  I picked up a bargain 13" from www.jigsaw24.com a few months back.  Amazon also often run discounted prices on Apple laptops, so they're worth a look.


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## Selwin

Victoria Bampton said:


> IMHO yes. Because the screen is so high res, you can always change the resolution from the optimum retina setting, to make the text and panels smaller if you need to. I haven't felt the need to do so.


So I went over to my friend John to compare screen element sizes between my 2008 13" MB and his 2013 15" rMBP. Interesting results. Like you said you can change the resolution away from the optimum retina setting. Guess what?
- At "optimum retina setting", the 2013 15" rMBP type size is the same as on my 2008 Macbook, but the rMBP icon size is actually larger
- Shifting one stop higher res on the 2013 15" rMBP resulted in identical icon size but smaller type size.

I feel that at optimum retina setting, the 15" screen is just large enough for photo editing in Lightroom. The problem with LR is that in Develop mode I need both left (history and presets) and right (sliders) panels to operate. So my image is caught between them and is not very wide. Yes I know I could hide the left panel and hover over to invoke it but I simply use presets so often that in the end i prefer to edit a smaller image.
On my 2008 13" Macbook I have no choice but to hide the left panel so a 15" would actually be very beneficial to my LR work. If I didn't have my 30" Apple Cinema Display for all of my LR Develop work, I would probably have ordered a 15" rMBP already.
I think I would still prefer 17". Now that Apple doesn't have them, one might consider 17" refurb but it's a tough call because it won't feature fast I/O like USB3 and thunderbolt and the current processors are faster.

If I could have only one machine, in the end I think I would get the 15" rMBP and a 24" Eizo photographic IPS panel.


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## john74

I'm using a Macbook 17" and the screen is excellent. I dont know for  Macbook Pro 15" non-Retina version if will also have an excellent screen.


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## Selwin

After using a retina iPad (iPad 4) for 6 months I see the difference compared to my 2008 MB. I think when cornered into ordering a new Macbook Pro (only in the event my MB dies) I think I will find it extremely hard not to order the retina version.


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## dtbain

*MBP spec*

Hi Victoria

Sorry about taking six months to reply -- life got in the way of this decision.

Can you tell me what processor your MBP has?  And do you think a separate graphics card is worthwhile?

all best

David



Victoria Bampton said:


> 1. I have the 15" retina and it's beautiful!  My EIZO looks really fuzzy next to it.  Just be aware the prints may be a bit softer than they appear on screen.
> 
> 
> 2. Correct
> 
> 
> 3. Yep, instructions are here: How do I move Lightroom to a new computer?
> 
> 
> 4. I have 512GB in my 15" and 256GB in my 13".  256 is a bit tight for space.  512GB is comfortable - I store my photos on NAS and use LR5's Smart Previews for speed on the MBP, although I also have a small SSD in a USB 3.0 case which I can use if I need the originals on a fast external.
> 
> 
> 
> 5. Yep, you can attach up to 3 external monitors (2 mini display port and 1 HDMI)
> 
> 
> 6. I've always purchased within the UK, especially if you pick up a refurb or a sale item from a third party seller.


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## Victoria Bampton

I'm not on that machine right now, but I think it's the 2.6Ghz i7 quad in the 15".  It's a couple of years old now.  And the switching graphics seems to be worthwhile when powering extra monitors.


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## dtbain

Hi Victoria

I am FINALLY on the verge of getting my wife and me MBPs and I just want to ensure the feasibility of the options I am considering for my wife and me to be able to access the same images and catalog (non-simultaneously) on the sofa (where we like to edit after long days at desks in the office).  I emphasise the sofa since it means I prefer small thumb drives to larger external drives if hooked to the laptop via usb!

So, one option is to have the images on a networked drive, in particular an external drive coming off an apple Airport (I think?), which my wife and I would non-simultaneously access wirelessly.

But I am told the catalog, even if we don't access it simultaneously, can't go on that networked drive?  Not sure why that should be, but if that's so, it's so.

If that is right, then the catalog could go on a memory stick and the images on a networked drive perhaps, accessed over wifi?  (I think you were saying that this is the system you have?)

I was worried that this option would be slow not so much because of the location of the catalog (although someone else is now telling me that that might indeed slow things down), and not so much because the networked drive is itself slow, but because the wireless connection is bound to be relatively slow (i.e. that even fast wifi would be slower than a computer's access to its own internal drive or to a cable-connected external drive). 

Does this seem right to you?  I take it this is why you said that, although you use a networked drive, you edit smart previews (which I take it LR puts on your internal drive) rather than the original images?  Is the idea that doing so compensates for the slowness otherwise induced by the wireless connection to the images?

And, final question, you also said you had an external ssd in a usb 3 case.   Do you think it would be faster and better for us to put the catalog and images on one of those.  I am interested in why (if this is the case) you prefer the networked option (except perhaps when on the road).

Sorry for peppering you with questions, and thanks in advance for any guidance you can supply.

(Btw, at this point I am going to go for a MBP.  The only bearing the above has on that choice is that influences what size of internal ssd I go for.  I am inclined to go for 512GB, but would go larger (at great expense!) if I were persuaded that having the images on the machine itself were the best way to go -- but, given our desire to both edit the images, I suspect it's not.)

Thanks lots!

d


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## Victoria Bampton

dtbain said:


> But I am told the catalog, even if we don't access it simultaneously, can't go on that networked drive?  Not sure why that should be, but if that's so, it's so.



Yes, that's right, SQLite that the catalog uses isn't suitable for network use.



dtbain said:


> If that is right, then the catalog could go on a memory stick and the images on a networked drive perhaps, accessed over wifi?  (I think you were saying that this is the system you have?)


I keep my catalog on Dropbox, so it downloads directly to both laptop hard drives. The photos are on a networked drive.



dtbain said:


> I was worried that this option would be slow [..] because the wireless connection is bound to be relatively slow


Yes, it is a bit slower, which is why I have smart previews with the catalog, and I leave the network drive unmounted if I need speed.



dtbain said:


> you also said you had an external ssd in a usb 3 case.   Do you think it would be faster and better for us to put the catalog and images on one of those.  I am interested in why (if this is the case) you prefer the networked option (except perhaps when on the road).


It probably would be faster, but like you, I like the freedom of not having an external hard drive dangling off my machine when I'm sat on the sofa.



dtbain said:


> I am inclined to go for 512GB


I have a 512 in one machine and 256 in the other.  512 is perfectly comfortable, 256 feels a little tight.


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## wblink

My ideal situation (whish-list) would be:

The most powerfull MBPro, big SSD and second hard drive (no dvd). Extra externed dvd and HD
Docking station at home with a 27" screen (Mac) and a full keybord/mouse and an easy way (is there a docking station for this) to connect the MCBPro?
Figured it would cost me between €6000 and €7000,- grand total, but with that money at hand I would leave Windows afters YEARS. It was the IPhone and IPad that made me realize things could be so much easier and pricier ....


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## jstevensphoto

Get a Mac 27-inch Monitor with Thunderbolt to connect to your MBP 15 inch and your life will be complete.   I absolutely love mine.   I have a Lacie 3T external hooked up to my Mac Monitor and all is well.  The Thunderbolt connection is lightening fast.   I can access any of my 20K photos stored on my Lacie 3T external in a few seconds.  My monitor does not have Retina display, but it's not a perfect world.   Good luck.   If you stay with Mac and Thunderbolt, you will be a happy person.


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## tspear

I am headed the other way. Yosemite has pissed me off so much I am switching back to Windows after being a Mac user for the last decade. So not sure I agree with your last statement. 

Tim


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## clee01l

tspear said:


> I am headed the other way. Yosemite has pissed me off so much I am switching back to Windows after being a Mac user for the last decade. So not sure I agree with your last statement.
> 
> Tim


I guess I have another 7 years to go.  I've only been using OS X since 10.6. And while 10.10 is rougher around the edges than others, it is after all 10.10.0 and it doesn't crash the system or lock up the system and I'm not forced to use a virus scanning app to fight off gremlins.   If you haven't used Windows daily for 10 years, I think you are in for a surprise. A lot has changed since WinXP.  Some for the better but many changes are negative. 
I'll be glad to see 10.10.1 but I won't try to replace OS X with a Windows product.

FWIW, I run Win 8.1 as a virtual machine on my iMac just to remind myself why I don't need it.


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## tspear

I have had more system lock ups, application crashes since I upgraded to 10.10 since its release then I did over the previous year on Mavericks. So I have opposite the experience. 
I have kept a Windows machine around but they are usually cheapish boxes used for testing. So I am only on there an hour or so a day so I have kept my hand in there. Most of what I do not like about Windows UI I can buy small applications from companies like StarDock to fix (such as the Start menu). Because I work in the payments industry among other things, I actually have to have Virrus scanning on my Mac. 
At the end of the day, Mac used to just "work". You did not need lots of little applications to make the system more usable/better; further Apple did not allow developers to hack the system. If you did and it became popular, as part of a security release Apple broke it. The difference is Microsoft tried and failed, and has gone back to an open system allowing you to tweak the Desktop so it is as good as 10.9 was before Apple wrecked it with Yosemite.
(I am a system admin and Java developer, so the only things which keep me on Mac/Windows is MS Office and Adobe Lr/Ps. Otherwise I would have Linux as my desktop like I did for many years).

Tim


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## Victoria Bampton

I would say that these days, due to their tight release schedule, it's worth waiting at least for the x.1 release before upgrading a production machine. It doesn't make the OS that much worse - just unfinished!


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## tspear

Victoria,

In this case I doubt it will get better. More likely worse. The Apple engineer who designed the over simplified iPhone hardware and mandated the single button, influenced iOS 5 and was in charge of iOS 6 and beyond. He was also in charge of Yosemite and is still leading the way. The result will be further changes to make Mac like iOS. I left iOS for the phone behind with iOS 5, and the tablet behind with iOS 6. 

Tim


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## jstevensphoto

Victoria Bampton said:


> I would say that these days, due to their tight release schedule, it's worth waiting at least for the x.1 release before upgrading a production machine. It doesn't make the OS that much worse - just unfinished!



Absolutely.   Nothing wrong with holding off on an OS X upgrade.   I thought about waiting, since Mavericks was running well.   But I must say, I have had few issues with 10.10.    Maybe I am  just lucky.   I guess I am an Apple fan boy.   Like the products, just sort of hate the Apple culture.   Almost like a you need a secret handshake or whistle when you walk in the store.   A little creepy to me.   Good computers, but not perfect.


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