# Creating Multiple Images for HDR Blending



## kitjv (Dec 8, 2012)

As a relatively new LR4 user, I am interested in learning how to blend multiple bracketed images in Photomatix & then importing the single HDR image back into LR for final processing.

Specifically, I am looking for a resource (i.e. tutorial, blog, support page, etc.) to explain how I can create multiple bracketed images of a photo at different EVs in LR. I am familiar with virtual copies; but am not sure that it is the proper vehicle for creating multiple images for HDR. Given the popularity of both Lightroom & Photomatix, I am sure what I am asking has been well-documented. I just have not been able to find it.

Thank you so much!


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## Tony Jay (Dec 8, 2012)

Welcome Kit.

Maybe I am misunderstanding your question ( so feel free to provide clarification) but you seem to wanting information on creating images at different EV's in Lightroom from a single image with the purpose of then exporting these images for HDR blending in Photomatix.
If this is your intent then I am afraid that this entirely the wrong way to go about it.

What will be required are multiple images at different exposures obtained _in camera _- these cannot be generated by Lightroom. Those images can be imported into Photomatix and a 16-bit or possibly a 32-bit image generated and imported back into Lightroom as a TIFF for final tone-mapping.

If I have misunderstood you then please correct my misapprehensions.

Tony Jay


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## kitjv (Dec 8, 2012)

Thank you, Tony. Your understanding of my question is correct. It is my understanding, however,  that images destined for HDR blending can come from 2 sources: (1) in camera (which I understand to be preferable) & (2) copies of a single image made at different exposure values. As a learner, I certainly could be wrong.

However, here is what I am trying to accomplish. I have a RAW image in Lightroom which has a broad tonality range (i.e. deep shadows & bright highlights; but no clipping). I am assuming that I can makes (for example) 5 copies of the master RAW image in Lightroom with each copy differing in EV only. Then, I would like to export all 6 images (the master + 5 copies) into Photomatix to create a single, blended HDR image. Maybe I should ask if this is even possible?


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## Tony Jay (Dec 8, 2012)

kitjv said:


> Thank you, Tony. Your understanding of my question is correct. It is my understanding, however, that images destined for HDR blending can come from 2 sources: (1) in camera (which I understand to be preferable) & *(2) copies of a single image made at different exposure values. As a learner, I certainly could be wrong.
> 
> *However, here is what I am trying to accomplish. I have a RAW image in Lightroom which has a broad tonality range (i.e. deep shadows & bright highlights; but no clipping). I am assuming that I can makes (for example) 5 copies of the master RAW image in Lightroom with each copy differing in EV only. Then, I would like to export all 6 images (the master + 5 copies) into Photomatix to create a single, blended HDR image. *Maybe I should ask if this is even possible?*



The short answer is no.
You cannot fool the Photomatix software - it will (should) know that each image represents a single exposure.

You are better off just using the excellent tonal adjustment tools in Lightroom to appropriately adjust the shadows and highlights to taste. Lightroom can handle a task like this with consummate ease - you may need some practise but any limitations at this point would reflect on you and not the capabilities of Lightroom.

Tony Jay


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## Glenn NK (Dec 8, 2012)

I too understood that it was possible to start from a single image which had been developed from it (although the best way to do HDR is with multiple images).

I'm wondering how Photomatix would "know" that the images were the same - they could be renamed (they certainly would match perfectly - one of the requisites for HDR)?

With the new Shadows slider, I can recover dark areas out that I could not do previously, so in effect, I COULD develop the same RAW file to achieve different results.

Alluding to what Tony Jay said, I certainly believe that many HDR images needn't have been done in HDR with the advent of the new engine in LR4 - in fact this was pointed out recently on another forum.


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## Tony Jay (Dec 8, 2012)

Glenn NK said:


> I too understood that it was possible to start from a single image which had been developed from it (although the best way to do HDR is with multiple images).
> 
> I'm wondering how Photomatix would "know" that the images were the same - they could be renamed (they certainly would match perfectly - one of the requisites for HDR)?
> 
> ...



There is some truth to this - but not as an absolute statement.
There are still many scenes where the dynamic range of the scene far exceeds the dynamic range of the sensor of any camera in practical use so HDR processing  is still a very useful modality.

It is also true, as a general statement, that the useful dynamic range of sensors is improving over time and so scenes that previously may have required HDR processing with multiple images shot at different exposures can be captured now with a single exposure.

I don't believe that Process 2012, per se, has made much difference, if at all, since any scene that exceeds the dynamic range of the sensor cannot be retrieved in the post-processing.

However, if you are referring to how well Process 2012 can retrieve both highlights and shadows incorrectly reported to be lost by the _in camera _histogram as well as just in general how well it deals with highlights and shadows then I am fully in agreement. In Kit's scenario the dynamic range of the captured scene did not appear to exceed the capability of the sensor to capture it so there was, therefore, no need for any sort of HDR processing.

It is also true that Lightroom 4.x (Process 2012) does a magnificent job of tone mapping 32-bit TIFF HDR images generated in HDR applications using all the usual controls to manipulate tone. Just be aware that the noise-reduction algorithms are not optimised for TIFF files and only VERY SUBTLE changes to the the sliders are possible before the queerest and ugliest changes descend on your images.

Tony Jay


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## kitjv (Dec 8, 2012)

I indeed agree that the tonality controls in Lightroom 4 have great flexibility. Also, I appreciate the comments regarding my original question. But I cannot seems to get out of my mind that I had read a passage in a book on HDR about creating a blended HDR image from a single image & copies at different EVs. Well, maybe the wine clouded my memory.  

Kit


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## Tony Jay (Dec 8, 2012)

Kit. There is a process where you post-process for the highlights and then post-process for the shadows and then do a blending process in Photoshop (the details, off the top of my head, escape me).
I would not term this HDR imaging.
Nowadays in Lightroom using first global, and then local controls, in almost every case, an excellent (and easily obtainable) result is achievable.

HDR imaging involves post-processing multiple images of different exposures that span the dynamic range of a scene that by definition exceeds the capturable dynamic range of any single exposure.

Tony Jay


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## Glenn NK (Dec 8, 2012)

Tony Jay said:


> There is some truth to this - but not as an absolute statement.
> There are still many scenes where the dynamic range of the scene far exceeds the dynamic range of the sensor of any camera in practical use so HDR processing  is still a very useful modality.
> Tony Jay



I did say many, not all.

So it wasn't an absolute statement - that's a bit of stretch of what I said.

And yes, there are many wherein the scene's DR does exceed the sensor's DR.


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## Glenn NK (Dec 8, 2012)

kitjv:  Check your mailbox


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## Tony Jay (Dec 8, 2012)

Glenn NK said:


> I did say many, not all.
> 
> So it wasn't an absolute statement - that's a bit of stretch of what I said.
> 
> And yes, there are many wherein the scene's DR does exceed the sensor's DR.



Glenn, I wasn't trying to catch you out.
I think the bit that you haven't quoted is more pertinent: that the usable dynamic range in an image is a function of the sensor not the post-processing software.

Tony Jay


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## gregDT (Dec 8, 2012)

I've completed the technique that you described in your original post in the past. However the HDR engine used was the one in Photoshop CS5 and not Photomatix, so I cannot claim it will work for you.

I created two virtual copies of an image and adjust one for highlights, one for shadows and the original for mid tones. All three images were passed to PS as a 'merge to HDR' function. From there I worked the HDR settings and blended the three back into one which was then saved as a stacked tiff file will with the original. Why not use three bracketed images taken of the same scene? My subject was moving so the HDR had to come from a single image.

The results were interesting in that while there was a definite HDR effect it was something that certainly could be achieved from within LR as others have mentioned above. I could obtain the (and this is just my opinion so don't shoot me) dreadful faux HDR surreal effect that has become the blight of modern digital photography, but there are easier ways to completely ruin a photograph.

So as a experiment it was interesting but was something I could do easier and quicker from within LR itself. We're maybe not quite there yet but for my day to day work I can effectively achieve a wide tonal range without needing HDR at all and so I wonder how much longer programs like Photomatix etc will have a market at all, but that's obviously another question for another forum thread?


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## Allan Olesen (Dec 8, 2012)

kitjv said:


> But I cannot seems to get out of my mind that I had read a passage in a book on HDR about creating a blended HDR image from a single image & copies at different EVs. Well, maybe the wine clouded my memory.


Your memory is ok. This is a technique which is described in a lot of places.

But it cannot add any dynamic range which was not present in the original file. It can only be used to cheat software which would otherwise not be able to take advantage of the full dynamic range in the file.

I guess we all agree that LR can easily take advantage of the full dynamic range in the file without doing any cheats. So this technique is not of much relevance to a LR user.


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## mhilbush (Dec 8, 2012)

I've only recently started doing HDR, so I am no expert.  However, if I had a single RAW image with a wide dynamic range, I would be inclined to use the tonal controls of Lr to give it an HDR "look".  I've done this with a few images, and was quite happy with the results.  There also are some HDR presets out there, although I have no direct experience using them.  Lr seems to be pretty capable with a single image that has lots of dynamic range.  To me, if your starting point is a single image, it feels like overkill to go the route you described in your original post.

Again, I haven't tried these presets, but they do look like they might be worth a shot if you're willing to spend a few $$$.
http://www.stuckincustoms.com/lightroom-presets/


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## kitjv (Dec 8, 2012)

Thanks to everyone for the enlightenment. I agree completely with all of your comments. And my experience with Lightroom confirms them.

A quick comment regarding HDR...my budding interest in HDR is not to achieve the "HDR look". When I was in Spain last month, many of the photos ops occurred on sunny, contrasty days. Throw in numerous narrows cobblestone streets & lofty medieval buildings & many of the scenes were a mixture of night & day simultaneously. So it is this dynamic range that piqued my interest in selectively using HDR.


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## roger100c (Dec 28, 2012)

A bit late but for completeness, you can export a single RAW file to Photomatix pro (v 4.2.3) from Lightroom which will accept it and enable you to use all the tonemapping commands available. No need to try to fool Photomatix. What it can do is to give enhanced local contrast (more surface detail). 

Photomatix have also come up with a (free) LR export module called "merge to 32 bit HDR" (downloadable from their site) which enables the use of the pre-processing facilities of Photomatix, particularly image alignment, before passing a 32bit Tiff file back to LR for subsequent tone mapping in LR. This keeps the workflow completely inside LR which I find much more consistent.


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## Tony Jay (Dec 28, 2012)

roger100c said:


> A bit late but for completeness, you can export a single RAW file to Photomatix pro (v 4.2.3) from Lightroom which will accept it and enable you to use all the tonemapping commands available. No need to try to fool Photomatix. What it can do is to give enhanced local contrast (more surface detail).
> 
> Photomatix have also come up with a (free) LR export module called "merge to 32 bit HDR" (downloadable from their site) which enables the use of the pre-processing facilities of Photomatix, particularly image alignment, before passing a 32bit Tiff file back to LR for subsequent tone mapping in LR. This keeps the workflow completely inside LR which I find much more consistent.



You are quite right Roger but this also holds for Merge to HDR Pro in Photoshop and likely, if memory serves, other HDR applications as well.

Tony Jay


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## roger100c (Dec 29, 2012)

Tony, you are correct on the first point about most modern HDR processors allowing a single image to be tonemapped.

With respect to the second point of being able to "merge" inside lightroom, I believe that Photomatix is the only one to have provided a Lightroom plugin to do the image alignment and merge to 32 bit TIFF directly without leaving Lightroom. This makes for a much smoother workflow. 

Even with the Photoshop version you have to exit the world of Lightroom to perform the alignment and merge. Photoshop (and almost all the other HDR processors) will then enable you to save a merged 32 bit TIFF which can then be processed by Lightroom using its Develop sliders.


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## Tony Jay (Dec 29, 2012)

roger100c said:


> Tony, you are correct on the first point about most modern HDR processors allowing a single image to be tonemapped.
> 
> With respect to the second point of being able to "merge" inside lightroom, *I believe that Photomatix is the only one to have provided a Lightroom plugin to do the image alignment and merge to 32 bit TIFF directly without leaving Lightroom*. This makes for a much smoother workflow.



That is worth knowing - thanks for the info Roger.

Tony Jay


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