# Start of marketing for Nikon mirrorless FF



## mcasan (Jul 23, 2018)

It will be interesting to see if Nikon and Canon change their lens mounts with their new respective mirrorless 35mm bodies.   If there is not a good way to reuse existing lenses, there will be some upset customers.     This should make for an interesting 2019 if that is when both Nikon and Canon will launch their new mirrorless lines. 



Nikon Preview Video Shows Full-Frame Mirrorless Camera


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## clee01l (Jul 23, 2018)

One of the reasons the Nikon V/J mirrorless bodies were so unsuccessful was the requirement for a special lens mount.   (The other being the thumbnail sized sensor.).  By correcting the error made with the wrong choice for the sensor size.  I certainly hope that Nikon is not obtuse enough to insist on a new lens out to force new lens sales.   Should they do that, then Nikon will be putting themselves out of business.  (if they haven't already)

There are those of us that got tired of waiting for a professional grade Nikon mirrorless and jumped to Sony (or in my case Fujifilm).


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## PhilBurton (Jul 23, 2018)

mcasan said:


> It will be interesting to see if Nikon and Canon change their lens mounts with their new respective mirrorless 35mm bodies.   If there is not a good way to reuse existing lenses, there will be some upset customers.     This should make for an interesting 2019 if that is when both Nikon and Canon will launch their new mirrorless lines.
> 
> 
> 
> Nikon Preview Video Shows Full-Frame Mirrorless Camera


For the first minute of this video, I had absolutely no idea of what was being marketed, or by who.  It could have been the American Astronomical Society, www.aas.org.


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## clee01l (Jul 23, 2018)

PetaPixels posts this link the rumored “Z mount”.  If Nikon requires a special lens mount for the FF Mirrorless,  I predict they are on their way out of the camera business.


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## Johan Elzenga (Jul 23, 2018)

clee01l said:


> PetaPixels posts this link the rumored “Z mount”.  If Nikon requires a special lens mount for the FF Mirrorless,  I predict they are on their way out of the camera business.


I have no doubt they will offer an adapter to fit Nikkor lenses on this camera.


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## clee01l (Jul 23, 2018)

JohanElzenga said:


> I have no doubt they will offer an adapter to fit Nikkor lenses on this camera.


They did not offer one for the V/J series mirrorless.


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## PhilBurton (Jul 23, 2018)

clee01l said:


> They did not offer one for the V/J series mirrorless.


the V/J series is not the same as a full-frame  mirrorless camera that might appeal to anyone now using a D3, D850 and predecessors.  The fact that the flange is both wider and closer to the sensor than the existing F mount is key.  this adapter would probably have no moving parts, unless Nikon chose to support older, non-electronic lenses.  By that I mean support for reading the aperture setting of AI lenses and stopping down the aperture with the necessary mechanics.  If I were in charge of Nikon, I would offer two versions of this adapter.  But of course I'm not.


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## mcasan (Jul 23, 2018)

Nikon may need to offer two adaptors.

Adapter to use older F mount lenses with new mirrorless body
Adapter to use new Z mount lenses with F mount bodies


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## mcasan (Jul 23, 2018)

Can't wait to see what Sony will introduce as a response if the Nikon is as good as A7III, A7RIII, or A9.


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## PhilBurton (Jul 23, 2018)

mcasan said:


> Nikon may need to offer two adaptors.
> 
> Adapter to use older F mount lenses with new mirrorless body
> Adapter to use new Z mount lenses with F mount bodies


A Z-mount adapter for F-mount bodies is technically possible, but the lens would not be able to focus to infinity or possibly much less than infinity.

Phil Burton


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## mcasan (Jul 24, 2018)

On Nikon rumors the author said he thinks the camera will launch on August 23rd.   Makes sense to get it and some basic lenses in the hands of reviewers and retailers in plenty of time for the holiday shopping season.


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## Johan Elzenga (Jul 24, 2018)

PhilBurton said:


> A Z-mount adapter for F-mount bodies is technically possible, but the lens would not be able to focus to infinity or possibly much less than infinity.


Indeed. A very unlikely option because it would be virtually useless.


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## tspear (Jul 25, 2018)

I was planning to upgrade camera bodies this year, I demoed a Sony mirrorless camera. It was really nice.
One significant reason I did not get it, was my existing lenses and filters. If Cannon changes the mount, I have no reason to stay with them.


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## PhilBurton (Jul 25, 2018)

tspear said:


> I was planning to upgrade camera bodies this year, I demoed a Sony mirrorless camera. It was really nice.
> One significant reason I did not get it, was my existing lenses and filters. If Cannon changes the mount, I have no reason to stay with them.


Unless they offer an adapter.


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## Jim Wilde (Jul 25, 2018)

tspear said:


> I was planning to upgrade camera bodies this year, I demoed a Sony mirrorless camera. It was really nice.
> One significant reason I did not get it, was my existing lenses and filters. If Cannon changes the mount, I have no reason to stay with them.


Didn't you consider a Metabones adapter to use your EF lenses on the Sony?


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## Johan Elzenga (Jul 25, 2018)

tspear said:


> I was planning to upgrade camera bodies this year, I demoed a Sony mirrorless camera. It was really nice. One significant reason I did not get it, was my existing lenses and filters. If Cannon changes the mount, I have no reason to stay with them.


You did not get informed well. There are adapters to use Canon lenses on Sony cameras already. These adapters (Metabones) maintain all the lens functions: aperture, autofocus, image stabilisation all works fine. I am a Canon photographer. I own four EOS-1D series bodies and many lenses. But I now use a Sony A7R and a Sony A7R mk III for my landscape shots. I only have one Sony lens (12-24mm zoom) and use the Canon 24-70mm on the Sony A7R mk III for the majority of my landscape shots.


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## tspear (Jul 25, 2018)

Did not know about the adapters. 
Now I have to think if I want to upgrade and try and sell my existing camera body or hold off.
The major reason for upgrading is weight the Canon 6D is still good enough for my hobby level. But I am wrapping up my last big trip for the year.



Sent from my LG-TP260 using Tapatalk


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## Johan Elzenga (Jul 25, 2018)

The Nikon camera was just officially confirmed in my country. No word on availability and price, just a development announcement.


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## mcasan (Jul 25, 2018)

tspear said:


> Did not know about the adapters.
> Now I have to think if I want to upgrade and try and sell my existing camera body or hold off.
> The major reason for upgrading is weight the Canon 6D is still good enough for my hobby level. But I am wrapping up my last big trip for the year.
> 
> ...



The value of your existing Canon DSLR bodies is not going up.   If moving to mirrorless, consider moving soon.


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## LouieSherwin (Jul 25, 2018)

Jim Wilde said:


> Didn't you consider a Metabones adapter to use your EF lenses on the Sony?



I tried several adaptors to use my EF lenses on Sony E. All had some issues from wobbly mounts to internal flares and none were fully compatible with all the Sony AF features. In the end I let let go of all my EF gear and went all native E mount.  

-louie


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## Hal P Anderson (Jul 25, 2018)

Here are some more rumours, these by Thom Hogan, who historically has been pretty astute:
And We Got Both | Sans Mirror | Thom Hogan


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## mcasan (Aug 30, 2018)

On Youtube you can see a world of different reactions to the Z7 and Z6 bodies and S series lenses.   More than I expected were not favorably impressed.     It should be interesting to see what Canon does in September.    Evidently Sony will soon release A7SIII with most of the A9 components aimed at video shooting.     It is going to be an interesting fall and winter for sure.


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## Zenon (Aug 31, 2018)

Canon just threw their hats in. Not sure if it will mount EF lenses.

Here's the full list of gear Canon will announce on September 5 - Canon Rumors

Canon’s Full Frame Mirrorless to Support Native EF Mount Lenses?


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## mcasan (Aug 31, 2018)

And now rumors of Panasonic and Olympus both doing something special.....beyond m43?       If they all go for the 35mm mirrorless market, there will definitely be some collateral damage by the end of 2019.     I guess they all want to be THE camera system used at the 2020 Olympics.


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## mcasan (Sep 8, 2018)

Now that Nikon, Canon, and Fuji have shown their hands I doubt Sony is too worried.   

Evidently Panasonic will announced a FF body at Photokina in addition to any new in their m43 line.   Evidently Olympus will stick with m43.


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## davidedric (Sep 9, 2018)

It's a rather odd move by Panasonic, at least to me.
I can't see that a FF offering will have any impact on their m4/3 business (as a m4/3 user, I hope not!)
At the same time, they'll need a very strong offering, body (ies) and lenses to gain a foothold in the FF market.  Maybe they're hoping that Canikon's legacy will prove a handicap with their variety of mounts?  Maybe they think their mirrorless expertise can eat into Sony's market? In any event it will take a deal of investment.
Any ideas?
Dave


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## Johan Elzenga (Sep 9, 2018)

I’ll believe it when I see it. And even then I may not believe it.


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## PhilBurton (Sep 9, 2018)

davidedric said:


> It's a rather odd move by Panasonic, at least to me.
> I can't see that a FF offering will have any impact on their m4/3 business (as a m4/3 user, I hope not!)
> At the same time, they'll need a very strong offering, body (ies) and lenses to gain a foothold in the FF market.  Maybe they're hoping that Canikon's legacy will prove a handicap with their variety of mounts?  Maybe they think their mirrorless expertise can eat into Sony's market? In any event it will take a deal of investment.
> Any ideas?
> Dave


Canon and Nikon together have HUGE brand strength and customer loyalty created by the installed base of lenses, as well as their reputations.  If for some reason I decided to ditch all my Nikon gear, for me at least, the ONLY choice would be Canon.

Panasonic's brand is more mainstream/mid-market.  It's always harder to go upmarket than downmarket.  (A striking counterexample would be the history of Japanese motorcycles in the US market, followed by auto brands like Acura, Lexus, and Infinity.  These exceptions only prove the point.  Mercedes failed at this strategy with their Maybach brand.)


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## mcasan (Sep 11, 2018)

Panasonic has the assets to buy marketshare.   I would not underestimate them for the long haul if they really want to be a major player in all areas of photography.


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## Johan Elzenga (Sep 11, 2018)

mcasan said:


> Panasonic has the assets to buy marketshare.   I would not underestimate them for the long haul if they really want to be a major player in all areas of photography.


I doubt that. Everybody agrees that Canon had a rather mediocre mirrorless offering so far (i.e. EOS-M, excluding the EOS-R). And yet they have the number 1 position in this market segment in Japan, with 30% market share according to Nikkei. Their world wide market share for all interchangeable lens cameras together (mirrorless and DSLR) is about 50%. Panasonic, Fujifilm, Ricoh and Olympus combined have a market share of 12.7%.


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## PhilBurton (Sep 12, 2018)

mcasan said:


> Panasonic has the assets to buy marketshare.   I would not underestimate them for the long haul if they really want to be a major player in all areas of photography.


Even if Panasonic "could" buy market share, it may not be profitable.  And if they "buy" market share by very aggressive pricing, it will be very hard for them to raise prices in the future.  It's always easier to lower prices.

There is also the psychological factor here.  Consumers often equate "quality" with higher prices.  There are some well-known (or at least often repeated) examples of this phenomenon such as Tag Heuer raising prices and gaining market share.   So Panasonic might be very unwise to simply undercut the competition on prices.

Phil Burton


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## mcasan (Sep 12, 2018)

Panasonic is likely going after the video market, not the stills shooter.   Their aim is to compete with Canon cinema cameras which are much more expensive than most mirrored or mirrorless 35mm bodies.


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