# Next CC update



## Zenon (Aug 30, 2018)

I read Creative Cloud will not support Windows 8.1, Windows 10 v1511 and v1607, and Mac OS 10.11 (El Capitan). A lot of people seem to be upset. I know nothing about these things. I have a 6 year old iMac running High Sierra. I'm trying to understand why. How old would your system have to be to not be able to run higher than 10.11? Is that the actual reason?


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## clee01l (Aug 30, 2018)

The Apple hardware requirements to run MacOS 10.12(Sierra) are :

MacBook (Late 2009 or newer)
MacBook Pro (Mid 2010 or newer)
MacBook Air (Late 2010 or newer)
Mac mini (Mid 2010 or newer)
iMac (Late 2009 or newer)
Mac Pro (Mid 2010 or newer)
Future updates to Adobe CC apps will be designed to take advantage of the newer OS architecture.   The compromises necessary to accommodate older technology impact the abilities to take advantage of the newer technology.   The current LR versions will still be available to subscribers to run on obsolete hardware/OS.  
Frankly, I don't see why anyone with obsolete hardware  (9 & 10 y/o.) should object.   If your hardware will support the current version of Win10 or MacOS 10.13 You have no excuse to be left out with the next Adobe release.   If your hardware won't support the modern OS platform, then it probably is time to get a new computer.   If your computer is older than your car, this should not be Adobe's problem or my problem.  If you can't afford the new hardware. Adobe is still giving the user an option to maintain their subscription with an older version go Creative Cloud apps.


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## Zenon (Aug 30, 2018)

Thanks for the info.  Sounds just like excuses to complain. Funny this came up about a month ago as I was saying to my wife next year it will be time to update the iMac. I was looking into an SSD drive for this one but I don't want to do it myself. Between the labour and thermal sensor it is getting up there and not worth investing. Even the person who services my stuff told me my machine was running well and not to bother.


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## tspear (Aug 30, 2018)

clee01l said:


> If your computer is older than your car, this should not be Adobe's problem or my problem.


My current day job the owner/CEO complains about getting new hardware. It was kinda funny, the other day a development server went down hard, power supply died and shorted he mother board and disks. He was upset and said how come no one makes quality computers anymore. This was an eight year old $2K server, I think it passed its life expectancy.

Tim


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## Zenon (Aug 30, 2018)

I have a stingy friend  who finally took his his car to the dealership and got mad at them because of the poor service,  mechanical failures, worn tires.  Outside of the occasional oil changes at other locations they told him the last time he had it there was about 6 years ago. He thought it was only about a year.


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## Dan Marchant (Aug 30, 2018)

Digital imaging is a rapidly developing field and the new techniques require/use state of the art equipment. As mentioned above supporting out tech holds back current development. Also there is little value in software companies supporting old hardware because the majority of people who have old hardware tend to just use the software they have and don't actively buy new stuff.


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## clee01l (Aug 30, 2018)

Zenon said:


> Even the person who services my stuff told me my machine was running well and not to bother.


Technology advances put the life expectancy at about 3 -4 years for a home use computer.  Software advances require hardware to peak performance levels.   If you are not doing more than email, web browsing and a word processor, then new hardware every 3-4 years is not a necessity.   Larger camera card files and additional features in Image processing software will require better performing hardware and software.    The same people complaining about  Creative Cloud apps not supporting older operating systems are likely the same ones complaining about performance issues with Lightroom.


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## Zenon (Aug 30, 2018)

Too bad my hobby can't keep up with technology. Yeah I think the guy as hinting I was better off with a new comp instead of the SSD.


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## PhilBurton (Aug 30, 2018)

Dan Marchant said:


> Digital imaging is a rapidly developing field and the new techniques require/use state of the art equipment. As mentioned above supporting out tech holds back current development. Also there is little value in software companies supporting old hardware because the majority of people who have old hardware tend to just use the software they have and don't actively buy new stuff.


So true.  From my own observations, people with really old hardware are also running really old software.  Nothing wrong with that _per se_, but people need to manage their own expectations.

Every software company has to define the "target" customer and their likely hardware/software.  That likely hardware/software isn't the fastest/most expensive available, but it can't be lowest common denominator either.   This approach applies for desktop software, for web pages, and for phone/tablet apps.  It applies to OSes, to browsers, and maybe to other software on that system.  

This issue is independent from the issue of people wanting support for newly purchased cameras (or the cameras in phones) yet running LR 4 or 5.


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## MarkNicholas (Aug 31, 2018)

I didn't think it was actually possible to keep older versions of Win 10 unless you disconnect from the internet altogether. Win 10 updating is quite aggressive and doesn't seem to take no for an answer. The philosophy seems to be update now and ask questions later ! The most you can do is pause updates for 35 days.


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## PhilBurton (Aug 31, 2018)

Zenon said:


> I read Creative Cloud will not support Windows 8.1, Windows 10 v1511 and v1607, and Mac OS 10.11 (El Capitan). A lot of people seem to be upset. I know nothing about these things. I have a 6 year old iMac running High Sierra. I'm trying to understand why. How old would your system have to be to not be able to run higher than 10.11? Is that the actual reason?


Sometimes a company discontinues support for an older OS or older hardware _only because they haven't tested the new version of their software on that older OS or hardware._  Testing is expensive, so companies like the minimize the "test matrix." 

So if you want to keep your older system, try the new version of LR and see if it runs or not.  

It's entirely possible that Adobe is using some features of MacOS or Windows that are truly found only in the new(er/est) releases, but probably not.  Adobe has discontinued support for earlier Windows 10 versions ("Spring Updates or "Fall Updates") but I honestly find it hard to believe that they are relying on features introduced by Microsoft only in the latest Updates.  Those kinds of features tend to be pretty esoteric.  Since LR is a mature program, it's hard to imagine that it truly needs those just-released features in Windows 10.

I  know nothing about MacOS, except that its release names are way cooler than Windows release codenames.  But even if you use MacOS on older hardware, give the new version of CC a try.


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## PhilBurton (Aug 31, 2018)

MarkNicholas said:


> I didn't think it was actually possible to keep older versions of Win 10 unless you disconnect from the internet altogether. Win 10 updating is quite aggressive and doesn't seem to take no for an answer. The philosophy seems to be update now and ask questions later ! The most you can do is pause updates for 35 days.


Actually you can, but it involves registry hacking, which most people can't/won't do.


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## Linwood Ferguson (Aug 31, 2018)

PhilBurton said:


> So if you want to keep your older system, try the new version of LR and see if it runs or not.



Sadly I suspect this will not work at least for subscribers (and only they will get the new versions anyway), as there are implications in the Adobe postings that the CC desktop app will be a policeman in that regard.  Here's one of their announcements:



> If you’re running Windows 8.1, Windows 10 v1511 and v1607 or Mac OS 10.11 (El Capitan), you can continue to run and install current and previous versions of Creative Cloud applications. However, you will not be able to install or run the next major release of Creative Cloud unless you’re on a supported version of Windows or MacOS.
> 
> Creative Cloud Desktop, which manages application installs, will continue to be supported on Windows 7 or later and Mac OS X v10.9 or later.


It doesn't exactly say that the CC Desktop will stop you from installing, but when I read the above especially that it will continue to work on older versions and you can continue to install older version (from that desktop) it says to me it's going to become a gatekeeper.

But who knows for sure.  Maybe there'll be a way to work around and test.

To your point, however, it's also quite possible that older hardware will run newer windows (Mac probably not so much).  I had an old Dell latitude, and decided to give it a try despite Dell prominently saying it was not supported.  It installed and ran just fine, without any special hacks or tools.   I also did an upgrade of a Surface Pro (very first version) and it's up and current.  So, with the caveat that the path back may be tough, it may be worth people with older hardware trying Windows 10 with a clean install (updates I wouldn't give as much hope for).  The most likely issues may be in peripherals, USB devices, etc. if no one updated drivers for them.


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## RikkFlohr (Aug 31, 2018)

Note: Windows 7 x64 SP1 will be supported: Upcoming Changes to Photoshop and Lightroom OS Support for Windows and macOS


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## LRList001 (Aug 31, 2018)

RikkFlohr said:


> Note: Windows 7 x64 SP1 will be supported: Upcoming Changes to Photoshop and Lightroom OS Support for Windows and macOS



Good since W7 and W8.1 are still in (extended) support.

https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/help/13853/windows-lifecycle-fact-sheet


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## PhilBurton (Sep 4, 2018)

RikkFlohr said:


> Note: Windows 7 x64 SP1 will be supported: Upcoming Changes to Photoshop and Lightroom OS Support for Windows and macOS


Since Windows 7 SP 1 is supported, that means that Windows 8, all versions, and all versions of Windows 10 should work.  

Phil


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## clee01l (Sep 4, 2018)

PhilBurton said:


> Since Windows 7 SP 1 is supported, that means that Windows 8, all versions, and all versions of Windows 10 should work.
> 
> Phil


No, it does not mean that .   The Creative Cloud App Manager will check your OS version against the supported version list.   There is a good probability that the Creative Cloud App Manager will stop any install of the  most current version when it determines that you do not have a supported version.


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## PhilBurton (Sep 4, 2018)

clee01l said:


> No, it does not mean that .   The Creative Cloud App Manager will check your OS version against the supported version list.   There is a good probability that the Creative Cloud App Manager will stop any install of the  most current version when it determines that you do not have a supported version.


"Should work" and "the App Manager will allow the install" are different issues.


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## clee01l (Sep 4, 2018)

PhilBurton said:


> "Should work" and "the App Manager will allow the install" are different issues.


. "The App Manager will allow the install" is the issue that needs to be overcome before you can even find out if "Should work" is even possible.   Anyone with enough computer expertise to get around the App Manager installation is not likely to be running obsolete Operating systems.


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## Linwood Ferguson (Sep 4, 2018)

PhilBurton said:


> Since Windows 7 SP 1 is supported, that means that Windows 8, all versions, and all versions of Windows 10 should work.


Windows 7 apparently has a lot larger user base than 8 or Vista, which would appear to be why Adobe is still supporting it.

 I wonder if it's a lot of corporate systems (and corporate Adobe clients) that are influencing the decision.  A LOT of corporate customers decided to stop on Windows 7 due to all sorts of issues in Vista and 8 with corporate installs, training and support.  Some are just starting to think about upgrades of their desktop machines.  I regularly run into clients still with XP out there, but I would say the majority are either on 10 or 7; I can't recall the last time I hit a corporate customer with Vista or 8.x in any number.


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## davidedric (Sep 5, 2018)

I've been out of the corporate world for a few years now, but the company I worked for had over 40,000 desktops worldwide, and rolling out a new release of the company standard configuration was a daunting job.  I'm not surprised many are still on Win 7
Dave


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## Zenon (Sep 5, 2018)

My wife worked for a big insurance company and they went from paper to e documents. Instant information for all departments. They set up a scanning dept and that's all those employees did. My wife is not an IT person but it was her project. That took some time  to set up and then the roll out - with the usual speed bumps. It was fascinating listening to her during it.  It was not easy.


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## tspear (Sep 5, 2018)

Zenon said:


> My wife worked for a big insurance company and they went from paper to e documents. Instant information for all departments. They set up a scanning dept and that's all those employees did. My wife is not an IT person but it was her project. That took some time  to set up and then the roll out - with the usual speed bumps. It was fascinating listening to her during it.  It was not easy.



I watched a medical company do the same migration. It was a decade long project, after spending a decade building out the IT infrastructure to support it.

Tim


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## PhilBurton (Sep 5, 2018)

tspear said:


> I watched a medical company do the same migration. It was a decade long project, after spending a decade building out the IT infrastructure to support it.
> 
> Tim


When I worked for Sun Microsystems we would call those kinds of project, "career bets."  Do a good job, select the right vendors, etc., and your career gets a nice boost.  Don't do a good job, or select vendors who don't deliver, and you might just be looking for a new job.

Phil Burton


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## CalvinHilton (Nov 9, 2018)

Windows 8.1 is an excellent choice. guess Adobe should have Asked Woody


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