# Whether to use Auto Tone at Import (was from How do I prevent Lightroom from Auto...)



## bobrobert (Jul 20, 2012)

As a side note, I was surprised to read in Martin Evening's book on LR 4 that he advises users to turn on auto adjust in import preferences. An experienced user of LR I think should encourage the use of adjustments manually without resorting to a wild guess from the Adobe engineers?

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Mod note - new thread created from hijacking this thread: http://www.lightroomqueen.com/commu...revent-Lightroom-from-Auto-Adjusting-my-JPEGs on the subject of how to turn off Auto Tone_


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## johnbeardy (Jul 20, 2012)

Sure you're not quoting him out of context? It's the sort of thing you might expect of Scott K but it doesn't sound like Martin's line.


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## bobrobert (Jul 20, 2012)

Page 63. He talks about the Develop preset. 

Quote

 I selected one of the default Lightroom settings: General - Auto Tone. I generally find this develop setting useful whenever I want to auto-adjust photos as they are imported into Lightroom. 

unquote.

This comes under the heading APPLY DURING IMPORT PANEL. I read this chapter because I wanted to be sure I was doing everything correct because my imports appeared to be slow. One would need to read the book just in case I mis read it. Personally if I read it correctly then I think this is bad advice because you don't see what the original looked like. I know the original is a rendered version of the raw but it is essentially a truer reading of what was captured and not a skewed version which you would see if you ticked Auto Tone. If someone  - not me - wants to use Auto tone then they at least should see what the original looked like? Michael Reichman in the LR video remarks to Jeff Schewe that he has never in all his years of using LR been tempted to even press the button. I think this is good advice but others find it useful, but not as a General preset?


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## johnbeardy (Jul 20, 2012)

Then I'm a little surprised. I'd agree that a general preset isn't a great idea. I do press the button quite often on the basis of "what's the worst that can happen?" - but it it very hit and miss. It's infinitely more reliable than than Auto in the B&W panel, though.


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## Denis de Gannes (Jul 20, 2012)

I do not find the quote from Martin is suggesting/recommending that "auto tone" be set as a default.
 He says "useful whenever I want to auto-adjust etc." does not suggest a default to me.


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## clee01l (Jul 20, 2012)

While I would not apply any adjustments on import of already processed JPEGs, I do find them useful with RAW images. I have a basic import develop preset that I apply to allow my NEFs. It includes AutoTone, so I won't object to anything Martin has espoused in this case.

I use the auto tone as a starting point to further development.  In LR4, I think AutoTone is somewhat flawed, but useful none the less.  In every case the Whites slider in over adjusted and I need to back off what is being applied in AutoTone.  Still using AutoTone saves me time because I don't need to manually adjust each parameter. 

And BTW, Adobe engineers are not making wild guesses and calling this AutoTone.  It is all mathematical based upon the application of formulas to come up with the final adjustments. This turns something that could be an art into a science. This can result in a good thing or it can render the image wooden and lifeless. It also depends upon the accuracy and universality of the formulas being applied.  In the case of whites, I think the formula is flawed.


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## bobrobert (Jul 20, 2012)

Denis de Gannes said:


> I do not find the quote from Martin is suggesting/recommending that "auto tone" be set as a default.
> He says "useful whenever I want to auto-adjust etc." does not suggest a default to me.



If you read my post again he states APPLY DURING IMPORT PANEL. Have you read the chapter in the book? If it wasn't a default then it wouldn't make sense to create a preset, just use the button to toggle on and off.


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## bobrobert (Jul 20, 2012)

Quote

And BTW, Adobe engineers are not making wild guesses and calling this AutoTone.

Unquote

They are making wild guesses with respect to your vision of the final output of your image. It is your image and imo you should be making changes that suits you? The fact that you sometimes have to undo what it has applied should make you aware that it isn't a good idea. Is it not better to start off with a "standard" starting point and add to the image? Personally I use the zerod method. As I stated earlier then you aren't seeing the image as it was prior to being imported. If you did then it is possible you could find it didn't need any adjustment  at all?


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## ozwebfx (Jul 21, 2012)

Denis de Gannes said:


> I do not find the quote from Martin is suggesting/recommending that "auto tone" be set as a default.
> He says "useful whenever I want to auto-adjust etc." does not suggest a default to me.



I agree, he is saying that sometimes it's useful to be able to auto-adjust on import but does not suggest that is a default behaviour.

Even if you have applied a preset on import, did you know that you can undo this to see the original, Lightroom is non destructive on your originals.


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## Victoria Bampton (Jul 21, 2012)

Welcome to the forum ozwebfx, make yourself at home!


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## bobrobert (Jul 22, 2012)

Quote

I agree, he is saying that sometimes it's useful to be able to  auto-adjust on import but does not suggest that is a default behaviour.

Unquote

Unfortunately I read this as a contradiction. My initial post was taken from another post in which I replied to and the moderator started it as a new post. So the context has been somewhat lost. The original poster complained about a preset being added to processed jpegs.  A preset imo being added on import must be a default because it happens during import. Try creating one and look at your history. It can be turned off after import but then in reality it isn't different from toggling the Auto button on and off. The danger is if an inexperienced user reads the chapter in the book and thinks it is a good idea to create a preset - doesn't turn it off - and doesn't start processing from a more neutral rendering. Using Auto means you have a double rendering of the image before starting to process it. The initial rendering from the raw data plus another rendering from Auto which means you don't really know what your camera settings you set looked like? As you can guess I am not a fan of Auto, favouring a start from a neutral rendering.:hm:


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## MarkNicholas (Jul 22, 2012)

Well who cares what the guy suggests! I personally have found auto-tone to work better in LR4.1 than LR3.6 and use it a lot as a starting point. However, I doubt that I have ever stopped there. I have always carried further tweaking. Just because some bloke suggests to do something in his book is neither here nor there to me.


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## bobrobert (Jul 22, 2012)

How do you learn to use the program. I don't think lurking here will suffice? Do you care about what people suggest on here?:hm:


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## Victoria Bampton (Jul 22, 2012)

Bob, I split it off into its own topic as it hijacked the previous thread and went off at a tangent which didn't answer the OP's question.

I have Martin's book in front of me right now, and I see no hint of him suggesting that auto tone should always be selected at import - just that applying a preset on import is an option, and that's an example of a use for it.  If you are concerned about recommendations Martin's making, please feel  free to email him with your concerns and see what he does about it.  I don't see a disastrous risk here though.

As with most things in life, we can act like lemmings, or we can learn what other people do and then make our own judgement.


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## bobrobert (Jul 23, 2012)

Victoria I thought mentioning my concerns about the possibility of someone misinterpreting the suggestion should be brought to the forum's members. It would have helped the context if you had left the original posters concerns in place. I think a note that it had been taken from another thread would have been helpful? Overall the discussion of the merits of Auto tone is imo worthy and something that should be discussed?


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## Victoria Bampton (Jul 23, 2012)

The context was how to turn off auto tone on reimported JPEGs, which has very little to do with whether auto tone was useful.  I felt that your original post stood in its own right.  At your request, however, I have added a link to the original thread.

Discussing auto tone is fine, which is why I split it its own thread.  But let's stick to the pros and cons of auto tone in different workflows, without making personal comments and judging other people's decisions.  There is no right or wrong - there are some circumstances where auto settings can be useful, and it's up to each of us to make that decision.


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