# File offline or missing



## Jeff.b (Jun 4, 2011)

I have just photographed my first wedding.  I shot in RAW and imported into LR 'Copy as DNG' creating a copy DNG files on my hard drive.  I exported the 'picks' as jpegs to my HD and now all the photos are showing as 'offline or missing', even the ones I didn't export.

Any advice would be appreciated.

jeff


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## Kiwigeoff (Jun 4, 2011)

What have you done???

You have broken the links somehow between the catalog and the files on your HD.
How to fix this easily will depend on your file/folder structure. Can you post screen shots of the Folder Panel in Lightrooms Library and the HD folder layout where the files are.


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## Jim Wilde (Jun 4, 2011)

Jeff, the hard drive you imported to.....internal or external? If the latter, have you simply lost connection to it?

Have you moved, renamed, or deleted these files outside of Lightroom? Is it just the new imports that are missing or is there a wider problem?

Can you verify using Explorer that the files are where Lightroom thinks they are?


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## Jeff.b (Jun 4, 2011)

Hi Geoff, don't know how to post screen shots.  The files are showing in the folders panel ie not pale grey in colour.  

Hi Jim, I renamed the selected files in the export dialog box, but I don't know why even the non exported file are showing as missing.

jeff


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## Jim Wilde (Jun 4, 2011)

Jeff, to take a screenshot you can use the Snipping Tool (you'll find it in the Win7 Accessories folder), it operates like the crop tool - simply get what you are trying to capture showing on the screen, start the Snipping Tool and then simply click and drag to select the portion of the screen you want. Save the result as either a jpg or png file, then when you post click on the Insert Image icon to browse to and select the screenshot, like so:




As Geoff said, could we have a pictures of the Lightroom Folders Panel, and a picture of the Windows Explorer view of the same folder structure?

And any answers to the other questions I asked?


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## Jeff.b (Jun 4, 2011)

Jim, I've copied the screenshot into Corel draw, snipped it, but have no option to save as either jpeg or png.

Geoff, The exported files were stored on the computer's HD and copied from there to an external HD. I also have copied files into other folders so as to catorgorize the images. These changes are only copied, not moved.  Can't answer your last point as I don't know where LR thinks the files are.

Sorry to appear a little vague but I'm not overly computer literate.

jeff


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## Kiwigeoff (Jun 5, 2011)

Jeff.b said:


> Jim, I've copied the screenshot into Corel draw, snipped it, but have no option to save as either jpeg or png.
> 
> Geoff, The exported files were stored on the computer's HD and copied from there to an external HD. I also have copied files into other folders so as to catorgorize the images. These changes are only copied, not moved.  Can't answer your last point as I don't know where LR thinks the files are.
> 
> ...



Did you copy the files with LR or Explorer?
The screen shot should be ok to post as it is, you don't need to put it in Corel!!
If you right click a folder in Lightroom (Folders Panel) and select show in Explorer does it take you to the same place as where you think/know they are?

Don't panic and DO NOT reimport files/folders!!


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## Jim Wilde (Jun 5, 2011)

Jeff, it would greatly help us help you if you can take us step by step through the workflow that you used here:

Did you import directly into Lightroom from card/camera, copying to DNG in the process? If so, what was the destination folder set to, internal or external drive?

Or did you first copy from card/camera outside of Lightroom? In which case where did you copy to? Then when you imported using Copy as DNG, what was the destination folder set to?

You mentioned that the photos were copied from internal hard drive to an external hard drive. Where in the workflow was this done, and what method did you use to effect the copy? Lightroom or Explorer?

As well as answering these questions, could we have another try at taking and posting a screenshot of the Folder Panel in Lightroom? This would be helpful. To take a screenshot simply start Lightroom and make sure the Folders Panel is showing on your monitor. Then start the snipping tool. The whole of the monitor display will be given a whitish overlay mask, and the mouse cursor will change to a cross-hair. Move the mouse to one of the corners of the Folders Panel and, holding the left key down, drag the cursor (like the crop tool) to select the whole of the Folders Panel. As you drag, the white mask is removed. When complete, release the mouse key and your 'snip' will now be visible in the Snipping Tool window. Simply click on the save button (the diskette icon) and you will be given the option to save the file (and choose the file type, default will be JPG or DNG, either is fine). Save to somewhere easy, e.g. the desktop, then insert the resulting file into a reply, using the procedure I outlined last night.


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## Jeff.b (Jun 5, 2011)

OK Jim,  

Workflow: Import RAW into LR from camera Copyt to DNG to a folder created on HD.  Did this process with 4 cards (different cameras), each time creating a new folder on HD (Card 1, Card2 etc.).  After some editing exported, as jpegs, the flagged files to the HD folders.  I then, ease of use, transferred the jpegs into sub folders of HD folders by highlighting and dragg/drop process.  I now have on HD folders Card 1, Card 2 etc., containing the DNG files and sub folders with the jpegs.  I then divided further by creating more HD folders named Bride preps, Groom preps ceremony etc., and using copy/paste selected images into the various catagories.  Finally, again using the copy/paste copied the whole master file onto an external HD'

Screenshots:




Let me know if you need more info.

BTW, thanks for all the help.

jeff


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## Jim Wilde (Jun 5, 2011)

Jeff, thanks  for the info and the screenshots!

OK, so what is actually 'missing or offline'? Certainly the actual folders aren't as Lightroom would report that with a '?' against a missing folder. So I can only assume that some (or all) of the photos inside one or more folders is missing....so how many of the folders do you think have missing photos, and are all the photos in a folder missing or just some of them? Any possibility when you 'dragged and dropped' the exported jpegs into the sub-folders that you inadvertently included the DNGs as well (a drag and drop within the same hard drive effects a 'move', not a copy). This would explain a lot.

Why not have a look in those various sub-folders to see if their are any DNGs there?


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## Kiwigeoff (Jun 5, 2011)

Jeff, I'll leave you in Jims capable hands as I'm off to bed -it's getting late down here however I suggest strongly you review what you are doing. 
All those subfolders such as bride prep can be handled by keeping the whole shoot (cards 1,2,3,4) in one folder on your HD and then organised in Lightroom through Collections using metadata such as cameras and keywords i.e. you can keyword all of the brides prep images with a keyword "brides prep", then you can either filter by that keyword and/or create a smart collection to pick up the keyword.
Using your HD as a filing system is time consuming and inefficient. Images can of course go in more than one collection without creating extra files - in the end you end up with a very tidy HD and a tidy set of collections, etc inside Lightroom.
I suggest you have a look at this:http://tv.adobe.com/watch/getting-started-with-adobe-photoshop-lightroom-3/be-organized/


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## Jeff.b (Jun 5, 2011)

Jim, all of the photo's in all 4 cards is 'missing or offline, even the files i did not export.

Actually I have just looked and it is the DNG's that are in the sub folders, I left the jpegs in the main folder. So this changes my workflow, having imported 'copy to dng' I have then exported the jpegs to the nominated folder which already contains the dng's then created the sub folder and d/d the dng's into it.

I think when I started the process of creating the sub folders I did inadvertantly drag all the files on 2 of the Card folders, dng and jpegs, into a subfolder then had to d/d the jpegs back again. 

Creating these sub folder was the only time i used d/d.

Screenshot of Pic library, this shows a link in the jpegs folder to the subfolder, is this of any significance?



BWT Jim, sorry for the spasmodic responses, we have visitors at the moment and I am trying to sort this out, entertain guests, ferry to and from the airport etc.

jeff


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## Jim Wilde (Jun 5, 2011)

Jeff, looks like we've found the problem. Put simply, if after importing photos into Lightroom you then move them *outside* of Lightroom then 'missing files/folders' is the consequence....because they are no longer where Lightroom thought they were.

I think longer term you need to rethink your workflow....as Geoff says much of the 'organising' aspects are better done using Lightroom's facilities rather than reorganising using Explorer and trying to keep Lightroom advised of your changes. I think you'll find Lightroom is much more powerful (and easy to use) once you have it figured out.

In the short term you have the issue of sorting out these 'missing files'. It sounds impractical (to me at least) to go through all these files individually and updating Lightroom with the new location, so perhaps it would be easier to put all the DNGs back where they were (using Explorer with Lightroom closed down), after which you could go through the organising process again but this time from within Lightroom.

Let me know if this makes sense to you, and also let me know if you need assistance in doing this (it would perhaps be possible to establish a remote session between out two PCs.


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## Jeff.b (Jun 5, 2011)

OK Jim, thanks.  Just talk me through the process of putting the dng's back.  Do I simply drag and drop from the sub folder back into the main folder.  And what about the dng link already in the main folder.

And yes, agree regarding the organising process, especially after watching the Adobe tutorial, thanks Geoff.

jeff


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## Jim Wilde (Jun 5, 2011)

Can you open that DNG! sub-folder within the Card1 folder and post a screenshot?


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## Jeff.b (Jun 5, 2011)

At least I have achieved something, I can do screenshots now.

This dng folder will contain all the dng files as imported from camera, whereas the jpegs are only to selected files afer some editing.


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## Jim Wilde (Jun 5, 2011)

OK, so I see a folder with some 543 items in it. Are these all DNGs? Do they all relate to one specific folder in the Lightroom Folders Panel? If so, which one?

Presumably there are similar sub-folders for each of the Card 2,3,4 folders?


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## Jeff.b (Jun 5, 2011)

The folder in the screenshot relates to the LR folder 'Stuart and Michelle Wedding'.  This contains 514 files because I have deleted some of them.

The other Card * folders are the same construction ie contain all dngs but only the selected jpegs.

jeff


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## Jim Wilde (Jun 5, 2011)

OK, are the other card sub-folders all named the same?

Almost there, just a final bit of clarification and we should be ready to start sorting things out....likely to be easier than I thought.


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## Jeff.b (Jun 5, 2011)

The other card folders relate to the same named folders in LR


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## Jim Wilde (Jun 5, 2011)

Sorry, not quite what I was looking for. Can you give me that Explorer screenshot of the Folders, but this time with Card1, 2, 3 ,4 expanded to show the sub-folders (I want to give precise instructions so I need to what the current folder names of the DNG folders are).


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## Jeff.b (Jun 5, 2011)

Is this OK.


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## Jim Wilde (Jun 5, 2011)

That's great, thanks!

So how do you want it organised....we can simply point Lightroom to these new locations, or you can first move them further up the folder hierarchy if you prefer. It makes no difference to Lightroom.

There will be a slight issue with the Card1 DNGs as the corresponding Card1 folder in Lightroom is actually the Stuart and Michelle Wedding folder which is also the Parent Folder for Card 2 etc. Not a big issue I don't think.

Let me know how you want it organised and we'll start trying to fix things.


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## Jeff.b (Jun 5, 2011)

Jim, What do you mean by 'moving them up the folder hierarchy'.


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## Jim Wilde (Jun 5, 2011)

Well, if we simply point Lightroom at the current location of the DNG files, you Lightroom older Structure would look something like this:


Stuart and Michelle Wedding (_will be Parent Folder with no photos)_
Card 1 (_although containing JPEGs, this will be empty as far as LR is concerned)_
DNG1 (actual DNG folder)
 
Card 2 (as Card 1)
DNG2 (actual DNG folder)
 
 
etc. for Card 3 and Card 4

Nothing wrong with that structure, though maybe one too many levels. If we promoted DNG1-4 so that they were at the same hierarchical level as Card 1-4 you would have a structure like this:


Stuart and Michelle Wedding (_will be Parent Folder with no photos)_
DNG1
DNG2
DNG3
DNG4
 
Just a bit tidier, but no real advantage either way....just let me know what you would prefer.


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## Jeff.b (Jun 4, 2011)

I have just photographed my first wedding.  I shot in RAW and imported into LR 'Copy as DNG' creating a copy DNG files on my hard drive.  I exported the 'picks' as jpegs to my HD and now all the photos are showing as 'offline or missing', even the ones I didn't export.

Any advice would be appreciated.

jeff


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## Jeff.b (Jun 5, 2011)

Perhaps we should go for the tidier option then.


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## Jim Wilde (Jun 5, 2011)

OK, let's reorganise using Explorer. First of all, can you take a Lightroom catalog backup so that we have a fallback position in case something goes badly wrong.

Then, with Lightroom closed, start Explorer and go back to that folder position as per the last screenshot. Then drag the DNG 1 folder from it's position below Card 1 and drop it on the Stuart and Michelle Wedding folder....this will promote DNG 1 as discussed. Repeat for DNG 2, DNG 3 and DNG 4.

Then take and post a screenshot and we'll move onto the next phase.


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## Jeff.b (Jun 5, 2011)

Sorry Jim but how do take a backup?


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## Jim Wilde (Jun 5, 2011)

That's a bit worrying, does that mean you haven't been backing up the catalog when Lightroom exits?

To force a backup, start Lightroom then do Edit>Catalog Settings>General Tab and in the bottom section (for catalog backups) use the drop down list and select When Lightroom Next Exits....then close Lightroom and you will be presented with the backup dialog. If there is a destination already filled in, just make a note of it (in case we need to go find it later) and click Backup and wait for it to finish. If there's isn't, choose a convenient location.

Later, you need to look at your backup strategy.....


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## Jeff.b (Jun 5, 2011)

OK Jim, googled it.


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## Jeff.b (Jun 5, 2011)

Normally LR backs up once a week.

OK Dragged dng's into main folder.

Screenshot


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## Jim Wilde (Jun 5, 2011)

OK, that's good!

OK, let's try sort out these missing files. Start Lightroom and go to the Folders Panel and make sure the Stuart and Michelle Wedding folder and the three sub-folders (Card 2, Card 3, Card 4) are showing in the panel (like the first screenshot that you did).

Then, right-click on the Stuart and Michelle Wedding folder and select 'Update Folder Location' from the context menu that appears. A file browser window will appear asking you to choose the new folder location.....navigate to the folder *DNG 1* and click OK. The expected result of this action is that in the Folders Panel, the Stuart and Michelle Wedding folder will disappear from the list, DNG 1 will appear, and Card 2,3 and 4 will be listed underneath DNG1 but will be greyed out with a '?' against them. When you click on the DNG 1 folder all the photos should appear in the Grid *without* any missing file notification or '?'.

Carry that action out, and then give me a screenshot of the Folders Panel, as well as confirmation that you can see the contents of DNG 1 without problem.


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## Jeff.b (Jun 5, 2011)

OK Jim, exactly as you say, can see all images in the Stuart amd Michelle folder without the missing or offline.


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## Jim Wilde (Jun 5, 2011)

Great! OK, now right-click on Card 2 and select 'Find Missing Folder' and in the file browser window navigate to *DNG 2* and click OK. In the Folder Panel, Card 2 should disappear and be replaced by DNG 2 and when you select it all photos should be there with none missing or offline.

Assuming that works OK, repeat for Card 3>DNG 3 and Card 4>DNG 4.

Let me know how that works out.


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## Jeff.b (Jun 5, 2011)

Thats great Jim, all present and correct.  Can't thank you enough for you time and patience.  

Was it moving the dng's into a new location that was the root of the problem, presumably this was why all the files went missing, not just the exported jpegs.

Anyway thanks again, really greatful.

jeff


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## Jim Wilde (Jun 5, 2011)

Good to hear. Sorry it took a little time, it took me a little while to work out exactly what you had done, but once that was clear the fix was relatively simple (it would have been a lot worse if you had deleted them instead of moving them!).

Yes, moving them outside of Lightroom was the problem.....it is almost always better/safer to do such moves from within the Lightroom Folders Panel. Although it doesn't have the same flexibility as using Explorer, it at least ensures the catalog integrity remains intact.


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## Jeff.b (Jun 5, 2011)

Thanks Jim, no doubt you will probably see me posting again at some time.

Cheers

jeff


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## Kiwigeoff (Jun 5, 2011)

Jeff.b said:


> Thanks Jim, no doubt you will probably see me posting again at some time.
> 
> Cheers
> 
> jeff



Glad it's sorted, thanks Jim.........

Jeff set your back up to once a day..... I do! - it's a Geoff thing, seriously better safe than sorry


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## Jeff.b (Jun 6, 2011)

Kiwigeoff said:


> Glad it's sorted, thanks Jim.........
> 
> Jeff set your back up to once a day..... I do! - it's a Geoff thing, seriously better safe than sorry



Done Geoff, thanks.........it's now a Jeff thing


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