# Scanning step-by-step



## Harry Briels (Jun 11, 2016)

My problem seems to be that I do not manage to ask for help in such a way that the help I get can be use by me. The advise I get assumes that I am aware of most steps that are necessary, but regrettably this is not the case!

1) I have a bunch of photos, LR 6.0, iMac and Epson V600 scanner
2) I want to scan each photo and place each in LR in the correct folder

How should I manage this on a "step-by-step basis" 
Scanner:
1) select Full Auto Mode; use "customize": specify photograph; 240 dpi; 
2) select "File Save setting; select as Location "Pictures"; type a "file name"; for Image Type I select "JPEG" Check all 4 boxes at bottum menu.
Then SCAN is being made and shows up in "Pictures".

So far so good, but how do I get this scan from "Pictures" in LR and in the right location?

I can copy the scan in "Pictures" but can not paste. 

Here stops my effort and I must admit that in one way or another I finally managed to place some scans in the right location after hours of trying and eventually not knowing how I suddenly got my scan in the right location.

Please if somebody is prepared to take me by the hand and help me, please continue my "step-by-step" approach.

Thank you!
Harry


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## Johan Elzenga (Jun 11, 2016)

You state that your Lightroom experience is 'Advanced', so I assume you know how to import camera images? Import your scanned images just the same way. Act as if 'Pictures' is a memory card, and let Lightroom copy (or move) the scanned image to the desired location during import.


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## Conrad Chavez (Jun 11, 2016)

As long as you want all scans in the same folder, there's more than one way to do this.

Method A

Set the scanning software to save the scan into the final folder location you want (not Pictures).
When all scans are done, import that folder into Lightroom normally (using the Import command, or by dragging and dropping the folder into Lightroom). Lightroom will catalog the scans in that folder.
I like to use the Auto-Import and Watched Folder features of Lightroom to replace step 2, so that I can skip the importing step. As scans are saved, they automatically appear in Lightroom. For the exact steps for those features, see:

Auto-import photos into Lightroom

Method B

Set the scanning software to save the scan into the Pictures folder (as you are already doing).
When all scans are done, move them (not using Lightroom) into the final folder where you want them.
Import into Lightroom.


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## Harry Briels (Jun 11, 2016)

Johan and Conrad,
Thank you for your useful help!

I  believe there is one essential difference  between importing from a memory card and the methods described for importing scans: the non existence of photo creation dates when importing scans?
When I import from memory card all files are stored on basis of a.o. the attached date information.
I assume that I can only add and or correct date info when the scans have already been imported in LR?


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## Johan Elzenga (Jun 11, 2016)

Muizen said:


> Johan and Conrad,
> Thank you for your useful help!
> 
> I  believe there is one essential difference  between importing from a memory card and the methods described for importing scans: the non existence of photo creation dates when importing scans?
> ...



Scans obviously don't have a capture date like digital photos have, but the files do have a creation date. You can always create dated folders manually, but organizing images by folders is not the best way to use Lightroom anyway. Organize images in collection and smart collections, and use keywords to identify them.


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## Harry Briels (Jun 11, 2016)

Yes, there is a creation date for the scans but this has no practical value because it is the date on which the scan has been made.


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## Johan Elzenga (Jun 11, 2016)

Muizen said:


> Yes, there is a creation date for the scans but this has no practical value because it is the date on which the scan has been made.



Of course, but that is the only one. If you want to add a date that the photo was made (if you know that date), then you will have to add this info in Lightroom.


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## Harry Briels (Jun 12, 2016)

Johan,
Using scans in LR is in the end far more complicated than you suggested in your first reply!
The weak point is that there is no creation date of the original photo in scans and that such a date can only be included when the scan already is in LR.
So to import scans like photos on a memory card (as you suggested) in an efficient way in LR and based on the original photo creation date doesn't seem to be possible?

I can't consider your advise to not place scans in Folders, but to use Collections, Smart collections and keywords as an easy solution. One still would need the original photo creation date.

So far I haven't read a practical and useful solution for placing scans in LR.
Harry


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## Johan Elzenga (Jun 12, 2016)

Why on earth would you not be able to import a scanned photo, just because it doesn't have a capture date? Of course you can! Lightroom does not need that date to import pictures. You may need it if you want Lightroom to automatically create dated folders, but that was exactly my point. Don't bother about dated folders if Lightroom can't create them. You don't need them. Folders are just containers for images, you don't need folders to organize images. Just let Lightroom place all the scans in one single folder called 'Scans', or whatever name suits you. Then use (smart) collections to organize them.


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## PhilBurton (Jun 12, 2016)

Muizen said:


> Johan,
> Using scans in LR is in the end far more complicated than you suggested in your first reply!
> 
> 
> Harry


Harry,

IF, IF the date of the original prints is known, then prints can be grouped by print date for scanning, and then placed in the appropriate folder by year, if that is what the OP would be interested in doing.

However, what if the creation date of the image is known only to the year, or month?   How can that be represented in Lightroom?  Or if the print date is just a range of years, e.g. 1950s?  I have not found a solution to this question.

Phil


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## Johan Elzenga (Jun 12, 2016)

Harry *is* the OP. The problem is that Harry insists in storing the scans in a dated folder hierarchy, where the date is not the scan date, but the date the picture was originally taken. Lightroom can't do that (at least not automatically on import) because that date is not anywhere in the scanned file.

The solution is simple. Harry needs to learn that a folder hierarchy is not the best way of organizing images anyway, so that he is making his life much more complicated than it needs to be. He can add that date in Lightroom (assuming he knows it) AFTER the images have been imported and have been stored in a single folder. Then he can search and sort on that date.

He can also setup collections, or create a smart collection based on that date. So, for example if Harry only wants to see scans from 2014, he simply creates a smart collection for that. There is absolutely no need to have stored the images in dated folders.


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## LouieSherwin (Jun 12, 2016)

Harry,

Here is an excellent tool for updating scanned images with the correct capture time after they are imported into your catalog.

In-Lightroom interface for Exiftool

-louie


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## rob211 (Jun 12, 2016)

Harry, there are no "right" folders. Depends on what you use them for.

Step back a bit and consider your workflow.

Do you have info about the photos you want to scan? date? place? subjects, etc? None of that is digitally available until you enter it; the scanner is just taking a picture of the picture. YOU have to add the date of the creation of the image, just like you'd have to enter a caption, etc.

I find that adding the date the image was created (which is NOT the date the file was created, and NOT the date it was digitized/scanned) is easiest when I'm scanning, since sometimes I have to be looking at it to figure it out. I use Vuescan, which makes it easier for me to enter that date, see here: Output tab Vuescan also allows me to name with sequences, important for say slides. Yes, some of that is possible afterwards in Lr. But I think it's much easier to do as I scan, YMMV.

But you could just scan into a "scans" folder, or one called "Disco Era." Then import that whole folder into Lr, and at your leisure review the images and compare with say the hard copies and add creation dates of the image, location, faces, keywords, etc, and then maybe move them to a new folder called "1978-01-10" if that made sense.

In short no one but you knows the date of the original photo. Maybe even you don't. The guy may look like a dead ringer for John Travolta singing "Staying Alive" so you might just arbitrarily add "1978-01-01" as that date. Add "disco era" as a keyword. And whatever else you need to help you find it. It's not a very automated process, but it can't be. Maybe one day Google photos will be able to search for years based on photo content, but not yet.


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## PhilBurton (Jun 13, 2016)

JohanElzenga said:


> Harry *is* the OP. The problem is that Harry insists in storing the scans in a dated folder hierarchy, where the date is not the scan date, but the date the picture was originally taken. Lightroom can't do that (at least not automatically on import) because that date is not anywhere in the scanned file.
> 
> The solution is simple. Harry needs to learn that a folder hierarchy is not the best way of organizing images anyway, so that he is making his life much more complicated than it needs to be. He can add that date in Lightroom (assuming he knows it) AFTER the images have been imported and have been stored in a single folder. Then he can search and sort on that date.
> 
> He can also setup collections, or create a smart collection based on that date. So, for example if Harry only wants to see scans from 2014, he simply creates a smart collection for that. There is absolutely no need to have stored the images in dated folders.


Johan,

I've never met Harry, and indeed we live on different continents, use different system types, etc.  However, I can empathize with Harry's view.  For my digital photos, I use a date-based folder structure, and I would like to have my 30+ years of scanned slides also filed by image capture date, or the date the slide was exposed.  Yes, I know that folders aren't the "best" way to organize images, but that doesn't mean that dates have no value.  

For my purposes, at least, sometimes I want to see all images taken at a certain event or on a certain day, and date-based folders make that easy.


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## Johan Elzenga (Jun 13, 2016)

Phil,
I do live on the same continent as Harry, and I can empathize with his view too. However, that doesn't lead to any practical solution. The capture date (Harry keeps calling it creation date, but that is the date the file was created) is not in the scanned image, whether Harry likes it or not. That means Lightroom cannot use the capture date to organize his scans in dated folders, at least not during import. That's the way it is.

Fortunately you don't have to organize images in folders anyway to properly organize them. Lightroom has much more powerful options for that. There are some practical reasons why it is still better to use _some_ folder hierarchy, but in theory you could dump _all_ your images in one single folder. It would be no problem whatsoever for organizing your images in Lightroom. I have a catalog of over 150,000 images and I _never_ look at the folder hierarchy. I keep the folder panel collapsed at all times. I can do anything I want with keywords, collections and smart collections. Harry could too if he is prepared to learn how.

You say "_For my purposes, at least, sometimes I want to see all images taken at a certain event or on a certain day, and date-based folders make that easy._". Yes, they do in this case, but you don't _need_ them. There are other ways. If you know the date (and how else could you store the images in dated folders), you can have Lightroom search for them in the Filter bar. In fact, the filter bar is much more flexible than a dated folder hierarchy, because in the filter bar you cannot only search on one particular date, but also on any range of dates you want. And you can combine search criteria, so you can search for images taken on that day with a particular camera or lens, for example. You can also simply add a keyword for an event. Then you don't have to remember at what date the event took place...

It has already been pointed out that capture dates can be added to scanned images AFTER they have been imported into Lightroom, by using a special plugin. That's what Harry should do. After he has done that, Harry has two choices. He can manually move the images to dated folders after all, or he can leave them where they are and use Lightroom's powerful search capabilities whenever he needs to find images of a certain day. I know what I would do...


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## rob211 (Jun 13, 2016)

In addition to Johan's comments, consider that even if you like or need date-based folders for scans, they aren't enough. I DO use folders for scans especially, since I may want to keep other's images separate, and it's easier in the workflow of scanning. I have folders for slide trays, for example. Not the only way to do it, but it makes copying and transferring them easier for me.

But those folders don't solve the date problem, especially if you use those images in other image applications, or send them to someone who doesn't have your folder hierarchy. Do that and your carefully applied date info goes POOF! into digital dust.

To be thorough, insert the proper dates in their proper places. "Creation" date is vague. Creation of what? content? file? metadata? the universe? Thankfully the exif/IPTC sages have thought this through and created categories for the different dates, and one should use them, since their use makes your files more robust, universal, and unambiguous (at least to date and time). See here for some examples of how dates are used: Dates in Lr: examples of differences


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## JimHess43 (Jun 13, 2016)

This reply is not aimed at anyone in particular. I have started a scanning project to scan 50 years of family photos to create an anniversary album To give to my kids for Christmas. I use VueScan to do the scanning, and I am grouping the photos right now in folders for each child as well as a folder for family photos. Then when I'm finished with the scanning I will have to organize the photos manually by date. The problem with scanning is that the creation date is the date that the photo was scanned. So unless you want to try to organize the photos before scanning there really isn't a way to organize the photos according to when the original photo was taken.

Scanning has its own set of challenges. The software I use is set up to name the photos according to the date I scan them. Then I batch rename them, giving them a name that I can use to sort them into different folders. The real challenge is going to be trying to arrange them by the date taken after I complete the scanning.


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## rob211 (Jun 13, 2016)

JimHess43 said:


> This reply is not aimed at anyone in particular. I have started a scanning project to scan 50 years of family photos to create an anniversary album To give to my kids for Christmas. I use VueScan to do the scanning, and I am grouping the photos right now in folders for each child as well as a folder for family photos. Then when I'm finished with the scanning I will have to organize the photos manually by date. The problem with scanning is that the creation date is the date that the photo was scanned. So unless you want to try to organize the photos before scanning there really isn't a way to organize the photos according to when the original photo was taken.
> 
> Scanning has its own set of challenges. The software I use is set up to name the photos according to the date I scan them. Then I batch rename them, giving them a name that I can use to sort them into different folders. The real challenge is going to be trying to arrange them by the date taken after I complete the scanning.



You can use this option in Vuescan (at least the pro version) to add a date that the image was recorded, not the date the scan was done: Output tab


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## JimHess43 (Jun 13, 2016)

Yes, that is true. I do have the pro version. But when I have several thousand images to scan, and they are not in any particular order, I'm afraid I would be spending more time trying to insert that date then it would be worth. Everyone has their own way of doing things. Personally, I'm not going to particularly worry about having all the images in order according to when they were taken.


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## rob211 (Jun 14, 2016)

JimHess43 said:


> Yes, that is true. I do have the pro version. But when I have several thousand images to scan, and they are not in any particular order, I'm afraid I would be spending more time trying to insert that date then it would be worth. Everyone has their own way of doing things. Personally, I'm not going to particularly worry about having all the images in order according to when they were taken.


Yeah. It gives me something to do while I wait for scans to complete. I guess I misunderstood; I thought you were organizing in folders by date.


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## Harry Briels (Jun 14, 2016)

Thank you all for your help and advises.
Perhaps some background:
I am using LR from its 1st edition and always felt comfortable with using it. I use iMac version 10.9.5 and Epson scanner V600.

Due to a heart valve replacement last February, which was more complicated than expected, I have been under narcosis for over 14h. 
As a consequence I lost a lot of memory, which should (hopefully) gradually correct itself?
I am trying to use LR but I sometimes have problems knowing how! 
It is not easy to accept this, but it seems the best technique to recover memory.

Why this photo album? 
Last year we lost our eldest daughter to breast cancer and I decided to put together a special photo album about her life a.o. for her children and our children.
All of the above is the reason why I now for the first time, try to scan photos selected from a pile of old photo albums 1961 through 1999! 

From 2000 onwards I have +8.000 family P.P. photos in LR, from which, in addition to the scans,  part of the photos will originate to create the photo album.

I have now imported in LR a first group of approx. 100 carefully selected scanned photos, with more to be scanned. I have post processed these scans and corrected the capture dates in LR. 
These scans/photos are in a date structure (1961 thru 1999) which I have put on top of the existing folder dates under "Folders", left side in LR, that begin in 2000.

So far I never had a need to use „Collections” but feel that it might be necessary to move one way or another, the folders dated 1961 -1999 into a Collection set up and then add a selection of photos (from 2000 - 2015) to this Collection.
Eventually I think I will then have to export the Collection folder to Finder and then drag the photos in chronological sequence in the album that will be printed.

You will certainly appreciate that I would like to keep matters as simple as possible!

Harry


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## Johan Elzenga (Jun 14, 2016)

Sorry to hear about your loss. If you want to be able to also sort the photos on capture date in the Finder, why don't you put the date in the file name? For example '1985-12-25-01’ for the first photo taken on the 25th of December 1985. You can do this right away in the scan software, or you can do it in Lightroom (in the metadata block of the Library module). Of course you can also add a descriptive part if you prefer that, so the file name could become '1985-12-25-Christmas-Dinner-01'.


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## LouieSherwin (Jun 17, 2016)

Harry and anyone else looking to scan your film/slide archives you might want to get one or both of these books by Sascha Stienhoff.

Scanning Negatives And Slides, 2Nd Edition provides an excellent overview of the scanning process. Tips and techniques for getting the most effective scans from your selected media, slide, film or print. Recommendations for scanning workflows. It also includes instructions for current scanning software, Nikon, SilverFast and ViewScan. He

The VueScan Bible - Rocky Nook provides a detail instructions for ViewScan. An invaluable reference.

-louie


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## Johan Elzenga (Jun 17, 2016)

'Current' scanning software from Nikon?...


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## LouieSherwin (Jun 17, 2016)

I presume that if you have a Nikon scanner then you may very likely have a working copy of Nikon scan software. As Sascha points out in his book there are some things that you can do better in Nikon scan than the other two. So it is at least something to consider if you have access to a working copy. 

-louie


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## Harry Briels (Jun 11, 2016)

My problem seems to be that I do not manage to ask for help in such a way that the help I get can be use by me. The advise I get assumes that I am aware of most steps that are necessary, but regrettably this is not the case!

1) I have a bunch of photos, LR 6.0, iMac and Epson V600 scanner
2) I want to scan each photo and place each in LR in the correct folder

How should I manage this on a "step-by-step basis" 
Scanner:
1) select Full Auto Mode; use "customize": specify photograph; 240 dpi; 
2) select "File Save setting; select as Location "Pictures"; type a "file name"; for Image Type I select "JPEG" Check all 4 boxes at bottum menu.
Then SCAN is being made and shows up in "Pictures".

So far so good, but how do I get this scan from "Pictures" in LR and in the right location?

I can copy the scan in "Pictures" but can not paste. 

Here stops my effort and I must admit that in one way or another I finally managed to place some scans in the right location after hours of trying and eventually not knowing how I suddenly got my scan in the right location.

Please if somebody is prepared to take me by the hand and help me, please continue my "step-by-step" approach.

Thank you!
Harry


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## Johan Elzenga (Jun 17, 2016)

LouieSherwin said:


> I presume that if you have a Nikon scanner then you may very likely have a working copy of Nikon scan software. As Sascha points out in his book there are some things that you can do better in Nikon scan than the other two. So it is at least something to consider if you have access to a working copy.



You may have a copy. Whether that is a 'working' copy remains to be seen. Unfortunately my Nikon Super Coolscan 8000 has a firewire problem that cannot be repaired, so I haven't used it in quite a while, but as I understand it, the NikonScan software wouldn't run on MacOS X El Capitan anyway. That software hasn't been updated in many years.


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## Conrad Chavez (Jun 17, 2016)

Yeah, NikonScan hasn't been Mac compatible for many years. I have had to drive my CoolScan using VueScan software, which I don't mind at all because in some ways it's better than NikonScan anyway.


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## gpsmikey (Jun 18, 2016)

The problem with the Nikon scanning software is they have not updated it to run on a 64bit machine and, from all accounts have no intention of supporting the scanners.  Which was why I got VueScan in the first place when I ran into that issue with my Coolscan 5000.


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