# Lightroom Negative Inversion



## dnp

I've used the forums search feature, but couldn't find a suitable answer to this question: Is there a user template for Lightroom that will allow me to invert my raw/scanned negatives from my film scanner? I don't like to use photoshop and camera raw for this... 

I've been to inside-lightroom and downloaded all of the presets, bbut can't find one that inverts my negatives. Any assistance greatly appreciated!

-Dan


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## johnbeardy

Look at inside-lightroom again. I'm certain there's a preset that does that. Look in the point curve area.

John


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## DonRicklin

johnbeardy said:


> Look at inside-lightroom again. I'm certain there's a preset that does that. Look in the point curve area.
> 
> John


Oh, they are there. John should know. He created one of them!



Don


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## rcannonp

If you use a point curve preset to invert the image, then all of your tone curve adjustments after that will be reversed. If all of the files you are dealing with are the same then it may not be a problem for you, but it would drive me nuts.


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## dnp

Thanks for all of the quick feedback! The inside-lightroom presets are an excellent resource, but the tone-curve issue would be a deal breaker for me too. I'm amazed that a simple cmd-I photoshop equivalent doesn't exist in Lightroom. On the other hand, I could easily be misunderstanding the problem altogether. Does Photoshop inversion also suffer the same tone curve adjustment problem?

...it looks like the only solution here would be to have vuescan archive my film in DNG (perhaps for later use) and then edit the TIFF's it generates. Argh!

-Dan



rcannonp said:


> If you use a point curve preset to invert the image, then all of your tone curve adjustments after that will be reversed. If all of the files you are dealing with are the same then it may not be a problem for you, but it would drive me nuts.


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## rcannonp

dnp said:


> Thanks for all of the quick feedback! The inside-lightroom presets are an excellent resource, but the tone-curve issue would be a deal breaker for me too. I'm amazed that a simple cmd-I photoshop equivalent doesn't exist in Lightroom. On the other hand, I could easily be misunderstanding the problem altogether. Does Photoshop inversion also suffer the same tone curve adjustment problem?
> 
> ...it looks like the only solution here would be to have vuescan archive my film in DNG (perhaps for later use) and then edit the TIFF's it generates. Argh!
> 
> -Dan



Command-I in Photoshop inverts the pixel values and then any adjustments after that would treat them in the same way as any other pixels. The tone-curve inverse trick in LR would be more like an adjustment layer in Photoshop. It doesn't actually change the pixel values, just how they are displayed.

I'm surprised that your scanner software doesn't have the option to invert the files. Does it have negative presets?


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## DonRicklin

*dnp*, I presume you are on a Mac, since you write of Cmd-I. Please fill in your Signature with OS, System and Gear so we can better serve you. Under User CP/Edit Signature.

Meanwhile, try VueScan from Hamrick for more options from your scanner.

Don


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## dnp

Ed, the author of vuescan, was kind enough to respond with this tip for me:

You can save the DNG files inverted by:

1) Set "Output|Raw output with" to "Save"
2) Set "Output|Raw save film"

A'viola, problem solved! 

I'm used a G5 Dual Mac, Mac OS 1'.4.11, Vuescan Pro, Nikon 5'''ED. 

...and I'm going to start shooting and scanning slide film, so this is hopefully not going to be much of an issue moving forward.

Thanks again to all who responded, hope this thread helps someone in the future 
-Dan


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## Victoria Bampton

Thanks for posting back Dan.  Let us know how you get on!


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## Richard Earney

There are 3 on this page http://inside-lightroom.com/point.php

And from those you are able to perform normal adjustments to curves. It is just that the curve starts from 1'' and goes to '. You then have parametric adjustments there after.

There are a variety of ways to finesse these. Standard curve manipulations (within parametric limits), use Adobe Camera Raw, or use a text editor to tweak the values. The Inside Lightroom Presets document has a wealth of detail about these methods.

Richard Earney

--
http://inside-lightroom.com


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## Rishi Sanyal

*Good to see another film scanner... *

"...and I'm going to start shooting and scanning slide film"

I just want to say that it's great to see another film scanner around here! 

Like Don said, VueScan would be a good place to start, not NikonScan.

Dan, have you built a profile for your scanner using an IT8 target? I recently switched from negative (impossible to profile your scanner for this, for all practical purposes) to slide, and have not commenced scanning slides due to the fact that I can't get a good profile for my scanner built yet using Wolf Faust's IT8 targets b/c I can't get a good profiling package up and running...

Good to see everyone else again 
Cheers,
Rishi


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## DonRicklin

Rishi, Welcome aboard. Nice to have at least one non Digital Shooter here to talk about this aspect of our world!

So fill out you Signature with OS, System and Gear listings, under User CP, above.



Don


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## hap0

Hi I'm also very interested in creating my own customized version of the Negative Inversion style of presets out there. Can someone suggest how to get started? 

Would I need to start from scratch or would I use one the currently available ones as a starting point?

Is there some way of editing a preset so that the point curve is not so linear from shadow to highlight?

Do I need Photoshop?

Sorry for all the questions. I've really been searching and haven't been able to find any good information so far.

Kind regards,

Hap


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## Victoria Bampton

Here you go Hap, here's some to get you going: http://insidelightroom.com.s853'1.gridserver.com/?page_id=12


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## hap0

Hello Victoria:

Thanks. I think I am going to start a new topic since my interest appears to warrant it.

Kind regards,

Hap


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## sizzlingbadger

If your on a Mac press ctrl-option-cmmnd-8 for a quick preview of inverted images. A handy little trick I have found over the years.


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## areohbee

Here's a preset file, edited to do only tone curve inversion: 



> s = {
> id = "'C94D77B-49'2-4E76-ADBC-F6433C6D86E3",
> internalName = "Tone Curve - Invert",
> title = "Tone Curve - Invert",
> type = "Develop",
> value = {
> settings = {
> ToneCurve = {
> ',
> 255,
> 255,
> ',
> },
> },
> uuid = "3'353C3B-14A3-4E79-A8AD-668EB3AAD56F",
> },
> version = ',
> }



- Save this as 'Tone Curve - Invert.lrtemplate' in your "develop presets / user presets" folder (then restart Lightroom) and you're good to go.


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## Mark Sirota

[quote author=sizzlingbadger link=topic=711.msg63'41#msg63'41 date=12686'7527]
If your on a Mac press ctrl-option-cmmnd-8 for a quick preview of inverted images.[/quote]

Cool, thanks Nik!


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