# OnOne versus Nik Collection



## Geof Leigh (Apr 29, 2016)

I use Lightroom 6 with Nik, mainly Color Effex. I have started to explore OnOne which seems to do a similar job. I have Photoshop but find Nik plugins easier and quicker to use.
Does anyone have experience of both Nik and OnOne and what do you see are the pros and cons of both.
Thanks in advance for any replies.


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## davidedric (Apr 29, 2016)

Hello Geoff, and welcome.

I do have both, though 95% of my editing is in Lightroom.

My main use of Nik is b&w through Silver Efex, which I like very much so I haven't explored  On1's b&w module.

I think On1 is much more full featured than Nik.  Of course, it uses conventional masking rather than control points, so it's blemish remover, Perfect Eraser, for example, works very well.  I also like the large number of filters (in the paid for version), the supplied Presets (actually filter stacks), and the ease of stacking filters in general.

Another key difference is that using Perfect Layers you can create a .psd which allows you to re-edit your image.  It's stored in the Catalogue, so although you can't usefully re-edit in Lightroom, you know where it is.  To do the same thing with Nik you have to go via Photoshop and invoke Smart Objects, which is a step too far for me.

Having said all of that, I have seen some excellent work with Color Efex, but for occasional use I think On1 is more accessible - but of course you are already familiar with it.

Dave


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## Colin Grant (Apr 29, 2016)

I guess the big difference now is that On1 continues to be developed whilst Nik has effectively been dumped by Google.


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## Geof Leigh (Apr 29, 2016)

Thanks for your replies that is enough to persuade me to download a trial copy. I will post my findings here in a few weeks.


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## clee01l (Apr 29, 2016)

I agree with Dave & Colin. On1 has a future. Nik hasn't had an update in 3 years. The Nik developers have departed Google not long after the acquisition. (I believe to Affinity).  On1 Photo10 is a complete standalone product.  When the new On1 PhotoRAW converter is released, they will be in a position to compete against Adobe.


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## Colin Grant (Apr 29, 2016)

Geof Leigh said:


> Thanks for your replies that is enough to persuade me to download a trial copy. I will post my findings here in a few weeks.



 On1 seem to be switching to some sort of membership/subscription model. It is all on the website but it is something like USD150 per annum for a perpetual license. That, I think, means that if you stop paying you will still own the software you have but will get no more upgrades.


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## clee01l (Apr 29, 2016)

Colin Grant said:


> On1 seem to be switching to some sort of membership/subscription model. It is all on the website but it is something like USD150 per annum for a perpetual license. That, I think, means that if you stop paying you will still own the software you have but will get no more upgrades.


As far as I can tell, this annual renewal of the perpetual license is only for the On1 PhotoRAW product and not Photo10.  And this makes sense if you want updates for new Proprietary RAW camera formats.


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## Colin Grant (Apr 29, 2016)

I did not read it that way I must admit, but it is not that clear so you could be right. Seems a bit extreme though if its 150 per annum just to add new camera formats. They talk about an easy transition from Photo 10 to the RAW developer so it gets more confusing. I might email support


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## Colin Grant (Apr 29, 2016)

Had a response from On1 Support - "Photo RAW is the next generation of Photo 10.  Photo RAW is all you will need in the future, all of Photo 10 functionality will be in Photo RAW."

So there we have it. It is a complete replacement.


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## clee01l (Apr 30, 2016)

Colin Grant said:


> Had a response from On1 Support - "Photo RAW is the next generation of Photo 10.  Photo RAW is all you will need in the future, all of Photo 10 functionality will be in Photo RAW."
> 
> So there we have it. It is a complete replacement.


Thanks. Now I have some rethinking to do...


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## davidedric (Apr 30, 2016)

As a Photo 10 user I just got an email saying upgrade to 10.5 now, and get Photo RAW when it is delivered for $89.99.  Offer expires early May.  It's a bit odd, since10.5 is a free upgrade anyway, so it's really a $60 discount for pre-order.

Dave


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## Geof Leigh (Apr 30, 2016)

Spent several hours using the trial version of Photo10 and I am impressed. Only thing I don't like is that some of the PSD file produced are around 500Mb. I will probably buy it as the price is reasonable.

Now what I would really like is the Photo10 style layers and masks facilities in Lightroom. That would make it a superb all in on product.


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## clee01l (Apr 30, 2016)

davidedric said:


> As a Photo 10 user I just got an email saying upgrade to 10.5 now, and get Photo RAW when it is delivered for $89.99.  Offer expires early May.  It's a bit odd, since10.5 is a free upgrade anyway, so it's really a $60 discount for pre-order.
> 
> Dave


I think that is a reasonable upgrade price (40% off).  I'm still waiting on my email. I had already updated to 10.5


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## Colin Grant (Apr 30, 2016)

The problem for me is whilst I liked Effects, I prefer LR and PS for my other stuff. It seems now that On1 are really trying to push into the Adobe space and I am reasonably sure that is not what I want. Oh an that offer - I got it too and I am not a paid-up On1 user.


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## PhilBurton (Apr 30, 2016)

Geof Leigh said:


> Spent several hours using the trial version of Photo10 and I am impressed. Only thing I don't like is that some of the PSD file produced are around 500Mb. I will probably buy it as the price is reasonable.
> 
> Now what I would really like is the Photo10 style layers and masks facilities in Lightroom. That would make it a superb all in on product.


With the new product promised by CaptureOne coming out in the fall, with layers, maybe then Adobe would feel the competitive heat.

Phil


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## Colin Grant (Apr 30, 2016)

Wonder if they will. They have PS which works well with LR and they are hanging their hat on the CC, which is a good deal imo. I guess it is how they view the stand-alone LR market that is the key.


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## PhilBurton (Apr 30, 2016)

Colin Grant said:


> Wonder if they will. They have PS which works well with LR and they are hanging their hat on the CC, which is a good deal imo. I guess it is how they view the stand-alone LR market that is the key.


Colin,

They could also experience a slowdown in CC subscription growth, or even a downturn, for the PS+LR package.  If I had my druthers, I would prefer to do all my editing in one, non-destructive, program, rather than a combination of one each of non-destructive and destructive editors.  The entire premise of LR is that it's an "all in one" product," but the need to go to PS or other external editor goes against that premise.

I hope that the new OnOne product is a roaring success.

Phil


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## Colin Grant (Apr 30, 2016)

I guess our usage differs Phil, which is fair enough. I find I rarely come out of LR these days and its editing is non-destructive so it works for me. Sometimes I venture out and tweak using a plugin but even that is rare. I use PS for heavy lifting but I do not do lots of that.

Competition is always good and I wish On1 well. I have tried their products but have always found things like their brushes very sluggish and the software prone to crashes - the size of the files does not help perhaps. So I do not see them as a real threat but hey what do I know  The product is not cheap either and certainly if I are looking for alternatives to Adobe, which I am not, it would be in the direction of Capture One.


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## PhilBurton (May 1, 2016)

Colin Grant said:


> I guess our usage differs Phil, which is fair enough. I find I rarely come out of LR these days and its editing is non-destructive so it works for me. Sometimes I venture out and tweak using a plugin but even that is rare. I use PS for heavy lifting but I do not do lots of that.
> 
> Competition is always good and I wish On1 well. I have tried their products but have always found things like their brushes very sluggish and the software prone to crashes - the size of the files does not help perhaps. So I do not see them as a real threat but hey what do I know  The product is not cheap either and certainly if I are looking for alternatives to Adobe, which I am not, it would be in the direction of Capture One.


I am still on the learning curve for Lightroom, but I can already see that I will want to take advantage of layers in Photoshop.

I'm also not looking for an alternative to Lightroom. There is so much effort that goes into learning a RAW editor well, that I would need a good reason to switch.  However, being able to do layers in the non-destructive editor could be that reason, maybe, possibly.  If the OnOne people could figure out a way to import Lightroom Develop metadata, that would be killer.

Phil


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## Colin Grant (May 1, 2016)

We all have our own workflow, Phil, but LR gives non-destructive editing and selective editing up to the point that I really do not use PS for general enhancement. If you want blending and the like then yes PS has to come in to play but the round trip LR/PS is so easy it might as well be a single program.


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## davidedric (May 1, 2016)

This seems to have strayed some way from the OP!

However, FWIW, I can see no difference in principle (in principle because On1 is not as stable) in round tripping between Lightroom and On1 or Photoshop, but for the occasional user I find On1's interface easier to grasp.

Any developer has to balance functionality and performance, and I suspect this is especially true for a parametric editor like Lightroom.  My vote would be for a well performing Lightroom with functionality based on what is available now, with layers (and pixel editing, obviously) delivered through plug-ins.

Dave


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## Colin Grant (May 1, 2016)

LR is kind of there now. I suppose one could say PS is a plugin to LR but that aside we have Macphun, the current On1 plugins and Topaz, although Topaz does not support layers I believe (although it can be used via PS layers). There are probably many others including Nik.


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## pdxrjt (May 2, 2016)

I have/use both On1 and Topaz.  Topaz does have layers through the use of their "Photo Effects Lab."  Unfortunately, it looks like they have stopped development of that product. I think that is too bad as the Topaz plug-ins have some amazing functionality, but would not be as useful to me if I had to use just one at a time.


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## Colin Grant (May 2, 2016)

Not keen on Topaz, not sure why. I quite like Macphun which works well with LR. Some of they plugins use layers and can also work with PS layers. On1 Effects is pretty good (with some reservations re stability and file sizes) but that looks to be near the end game as a standalone plugin  - it will become part go the new RAW development due this autumn. At the end of the day I can do everything the plugins give in LR/PS so I do not really need them, but they do make for fast processing.


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## Jknights (May 26, 2016)

PhilBurton said:


> With the new product promised by CaptureOne coming out in the fall, with layers, maybe then Adobe would feel the competitive heat.
> 
> Phil



CaptureOne Pro v9.x has Layers but what is delivered in the future may be an enhancement to this but I dont know any details. 
Until it has Actions a la Photoshop then while it is great to use, once you understand and learn the interface, but has limitations.  Lightroom is much easier to learn, so I would tend to point people and my students at Lightroom if they have nothing currently.

I have both Nik Collection and OnOne10 along with CaptureOnePro v9.11 and Lightroom 6.5.1 and I use them interchangeably.
The NikCollection works well for me in LR and Photoshop, as does the OnOne10 product, but the results out of OnOne10 are sometimes inclined to be less well controlled (noise and subtlety of changes) IMHO.  This my be down to my greater experience of using LR.  

For me there is no DAM that is better than Lightroom for speed and ease of use.  
iMatch on Windows is faster but doesnt have the ease of use of LR.  
CaptureOne Pro v9.x also has catalogs but they are slower than Lightroom but for SOME (note some images from some cameras Fuji X series) there is a a difference in IQ and I prefer the COP9 output for my Fuji RAW files.  For my Nikons I struggle to see any differences between LR and COP.


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