# System Display Colour Profiles



## Deeps (Feb 7, 2020)

Could I please enquire from other MacBook Pro users running Catalina 10.15.3 what system preferences with respect to the Display they are using?

(a) In System Preferences > Display are you checking or unchecking True Tone?

(b) in System Preferences > Display > Colour there is a long list of colour profiles.  Should a profile be chosen from this list or can it be ignored?


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## LouieSherwin (Feb 7, 2020)

For the purposes of using Lightroom and other photo editors you do not want to turn on True Tone. This will dynamically adjust the display color tempurature to match the ambient light. This is absolutely not what you want to be happening while trying to edit your images. 

Having a good quality monitor profile is also important to being able to establish consistent results working in Lightroom. Apple provides a generic profile that is good enough for general purpose use. But to if you care about having accurate and consistent results from capture thru editing on to sharing on a web gallery and especially printing you will need to invest in a colorimeter and associated profile generation software and use that to make a custom profile for your MacBook Pro display. 

One of the best is the X-Rite i1Display Pro which comes with the i1Profiler software for about $280. This is the one I use. There are other options but I cannot recall them of the top of my head. 

We receive a fair number of requests for help solving problems where someone is trying to print or publish to the web and the output does not match what they are seeing in Lightroom. The very first thing that is always asked is has the display been calibrated which is to say  does the user have a good color profile. Without that it is practically impossible create consistent color in your workflow. 

So the bad news is that you  need to spend some more money but it is one of the best things you can do to ensure that your color is consistent.

-louie


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## Paul McFarlane (Feb 7, 2020)

Page 196 on in your Classic FAQ book explains calibration a lot more too.


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## clee01l (Feb 7, 2020)

Deeps said:


> Could I please enquire from other MacBook Pro users running Catalina 10.15.3 what system preferences with respect to the Display they are using?
> 
> (a) In System Preferences > Display are you checking or unchecking True Tone?
> 
> (b) in System Preferences > Display > Colour there is a long list of colour profiles. Should a profile be chosen from this list or can it be ignored?



I have an I1Display Profiler but since I got my last iMac, I have the display profile set to the Apple Standard “Display-P3”


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## kimballistic (Feb 7, 2020)

clee01l said:


> I have an I1Display Profiler but since I got my last iMac, I have the display profile set to the Apple Standard “Display-P3”



Display P3 is not a monitor profile, it is a color space.  The only way to choose it is to deselect "show profiles for this display only."  Generally not a good idea unless you really know what you're doing.  From Apple's help:



> To see additional color profiles (including those not for use with your display), deselect “Show profiles for this display only.” Only use these additional profiles if you understand the impact they will have on your color workflow.



Since you already own a device that can build a custom profile for your monitor, why not use it?


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## clee01l (Feb 8, 2020)

kimballistic said:


> Display P3 is not a monitor profile, it is a color space.  The only way to choose it is to deselect "show profiles for this display only."  Generally not a good idea unless you really know what you're doing.  From Apple's help:
> Since you already own a device that can build a custom profile for your monitor, why not use it?


 If you have a recent Apple P3 capable display, under Display preferences you have  "Display P3" listed as one of the   Display profiles available (including BTW, those that I generated using my  I1Display Profiler).  If I check the box labeled  "Show Profiles for this Display only",  I have two listed: "iMac" and "Display P3"

Perhaps you are confusing this with the DCI P3 color space which Apple has based this color profile on?


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## kimballistic (Feb 8, 2020)

clee01l said:


> If you have a recent Apple P3 capable display, under Display preferences you have  "Display P3" listed as one of the   Display profiles available (including BTW, those that I generated using my  I1Display Profiler).  If I check the box labeled  "Show Profiles for this Display only",  I have two listed: "iMac" and "Display P3"



Interesting! I have 3 Display P3-capable monitors, 2 from LG & 1 from Apple.  Display Preferences does not list the Display P3 entry for any of them.  Either way, I wouldn't use it-- it's not a profile of a specific device.

I guess my question still stands though- if you have a  device that can generate a custom profile for your specific monitor, why not use it?



> Perhaps you are confusing this with the DCI P3 color space which Apple has based this color profile on?



No, I'm familiar with the Display P3 color space and its differences from DCI-P3.


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## Victoria Bampton (Feb 8, 2020)

kimballistic said:


> I guess my question still stands though- if you have a  device that can generate a custom profile for your specific monitor, why not use it?


Yes, if you can generate a profile for your monitor through calibration, that would be your best choice. What device do you have?


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## kimballistic (Feb 8, 2020)

Victoria Bampton said:


> Yes, if you can generate a profile for your monitor through calibration, that would be your best choice. What device do you have?


Sorry, I may not have been clear.  I already calibrate my monitors and profile them on a regular basis with an X-Rite i1Display Pro driven by DisplayCAL/ArgyllCMS.

I was asking Cletus why he's choosing to use a generic color profile for his monitor when he already owns an i1Display and could (should?) be using it to create a custom profile for his exact hardware.

My general thrust in this thread, and why I chimed in, was to make sure other readers don't get the impression that using "Display P3" or some other color space profile for their monitor profile is a good idea.

In the absence of profiling hardware like the i1Display, iMac users should be using the default, device-specific "iMac" profile (and MacBook Pro users  the "Color LCD" profile).  The other profiles listed like sRGB, Display P3, Adobe RGB, etc are device-independent color profiles that are not meant to be used as monitor profiles.


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## Johan Elzenga (Feb 9, 2020)

I agree that if you have the hardware to create your own monitor profile, you should use it. If you compare the Display P3 profile with your own profile on a recent MacBook Pro (in ColorSync Utility), you will notice that the difference is extremely small however. You will probably not get any practical problems using Display P3 as your monitor profile.


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## Deeps (Feb 9, 2020)

kimballistic said:


> In the absence of profiling hardware like the i1Display, iMac users should be using the default, device-specific "iMac" profile (and MacBook Pro users  the "Color LCD" profile).  The other profiles listed like sRGB, Display P3, Adobe RGB, etc are device-independent color profiles that are not meant to be used as monitor profiles.



Interesting. For now I'll stick with the Colour LCD profile and see how things pan out. I don't earn a living from photography and therefore try and keep my expenditure down to what I consider reasonable. I have produced some exceedingly good photo albums in the past and although from a colour perspective a true professional might find cause for critic they fulfil my expectations. If, over time things change for the worse I shall reconsider investing in a calibration device. Whatever the case, thanks for your input.



Paul McFarlane said:


> Page 196 on in your Classic FAQ book explains calibration a lot more too.



Doh, now why didn't I consider looking there.  

To all others - many thanks for taking the time to reply, the discussion has been very interesting to me at least.


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## LouieSherwin (Feb 9, 2020)

@Johan Elzenga , 

@kimballistic raises an important distinction. That is the one between "color space" and  "device specific" profiles.  This is something that I was trying to describe in my initial reply. 

Display P3, sRGB, Adobe RGB and ProPhoto RGB are all color spaces. Primarily, they define a maximum range of possible colors from a color reference model such as Lab. They have absolutely no knowledge of how a specific device, display panel in this case will render colors.  It is confusing that most of these are tagged as "display" type profiles because they are really not.

A device specific profile contains the knowledge of exactly how a specific display renders colors in your environment.  Without a good monitor profile you are  going to have trouble achieving consistent visual matching (WYSIWYG)  though your workflow. This can very quickly start to run into color rendering mismatches as you edit and print in Lightroom.  

I  think  that it is a bad idea to assign a color space profile to your display for day to day work. In lieu of your own custom monitor profiles the generic device profiles @kimballistic identified are a much better way to go similar to using generic profiles for you printer/paper. 

-louie


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## Johan Elzenga (Feb 9, 2020)

Actually, sRGB etc are *abstract* color spaces, also known as *working spaces,*  while your monitor profile describes the *device specific* color space of your monitor. A monitor has a color space too, but a different type because it is bound to this particular device, while sRGB, AdobeRGB, Display P3 etc are not device specific. Color Management: Understanding Color Spaces

I fully agree that you should create a custom profile for your monitor. Especially if you have the hardware to do it! I just pointed out that in practise you will find that the color space of a MacBook Pro monitor (at least my 13" MBP) is very close to Display P3.


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